Cash corruption in my opinion is slightly too high, when a single day of sales nowadays on a non self farmed country in FFA, pretty much maxes the 2b limit on its own, I think it should be a lower % that is lost.
But that is my opinion and not why I made this thread.

People have to stock something besides cash, as having more then 2b cash is extremely impractical, and wasteful.

And judging from just general experience, and most common governments, as well as how poorly certain types fair at netting, I would say Communism Indu is the worst at higher NW's, followed by tyranny then monarchy. In terms of warring, communism and monarchy are in the low range too. For a commie to stock up on war type tech he needs to sell his indu stuff, buy tech, taking a 10% hit on each exchange, his 120% tech bonus is countered out solely from that. Not to mention communism indu's have a very high military expenses, as well as generally a pretty shallow cash flow (if someone doesn't sell you will have to wait a day or more to use a turn).

I know this has been long but just getting at what I think would be a good idea.

What about getting rid of cash corruption for communism governments.

A) This would be easy to implement
B) Very difficult to exploit, the 10% market loss on any exchange guarantees that.
C) Gives some sort of end game potential to communist governments if ran right, as opposed to no potential pretty much.

Possibly include this in monarchy as well, but the drawbacks of communism counter the potential advantages of exploiting this, not so with monarchy. Tyranny maybe, but tyranny is already pretty good and has its own niche.

Id like to hear people's thoughts.

o.O it doesn't make sense with the commie name -- no corruption in a communist government? ha! lol

I'd like to see a few good players run some hardcore indy's next set -- I think they'll be able to do significantly better already; we've really pumped up CI recently, and this PM military bit will really help them too

the corruption is as high as food decay so theres not an advantage to having cash instead of food which might harm the food market somewhat

all that selling more than 2b, say if i was selling 3b tech really means is you can buy 1b food when you login if you want to, otherwise you would have needed to play twice and buy stuff

communism seems ok now but market dependant

its:

1.88*1.35*1.6=4.0608 turrets/acre

3.65472 after commision

that puts it at $721 max $/acre assuming selling at just below market autobuy on turrets

which is higher than rep cash, and commie just got the biggest boost from private destock so now it avoids 10% commisions if you choose to destock that way and you can always go demo or theo

no corruption assuming you didnt get grabbed would be a massive benefit

you could stock normally, destock all food/oil at peak then just hold billions of cash until you chose to jump

and it would be better to stay commie for destock than take 14% loss or a 10% and 6% commision to go demo or theo

I know it doesn't make sense realistically, but lets me realistic about this :P How much do the other governments have to do with reality other then Demo taking 3 turns to attack someone, lol.

And yes the PM bit will help them out slightly, but not a whole lot. And could I make a great commie indu, yes I could. Could I compete with other governments for netting, not even close... For war, if near start of set yes, if later on, then not even then.

But I do think that getting rid of corruption would be a great idea. It doesn't affect anything that commies do, most don't stockpile billions and billions of cash, but it would give one more option for running a commie. It will only end affecting the servers with high turn rates per set at that, where stockpiling is a must, and military cannot be stockpiled (this is their issue)

Enshula, I know you better then this, and both of us know that you can stockpile food on market at high prices so it wont be sold and corruption wont affect it.

Also I am sure you know that commie's expenses on average are probably half again the rep's with the same STARTING military when you use your turns.

Actually they should be the same if they have the same military. If they have the same military TECH however (in terms of points), the Commie should have lower expenses.

yes but in express for example buying and selling is a pain so its better to just have cash on hand unless your a demo, with double commisions you lose close to 20% if dumping on public, 10% if on private, and probably buy the food for less than you sell it for as well

if the corruption goes too low then no one will buy food for stocking which probably isnt what people want

maybe 0.05% which is half current would be ok, no real reason it wouldnt be, but 0% would be a problem

expenses are just one more reason indys are a pain and double selling is good, though usually indys had more mil than they needed to avoid being grabbed so maybe the higher sell rates now mean its not as big an issue

im not sure its a big enough factor but would be interesting to have a commie casher that just kept cashing and never had to buy food, would be a bit like a demo without the 10% tech bonus that wasnt affected by food peak

food peak would probably need to be very large for it to work though

Aye, true, but I am talking about playing a days worth of turns while stocking. A reps ending expenses will be the same as they started with.
A commie that is stocking will be selling 1/3 (35% ish) of all its military a day, so to reach that point it will end up with 50% more military then it started with.
Assumming you sell everytime. If you don't sell and have to wait and use 2 days worth of turns, you will end up with double the expenses you started with, and take a while to go down to just the 50% increase.

Say Rep starts with 1mil expenses
Commie starts with 1mil.

Reps ends with 1mil after 80 turns, costing 80mil. It's income is constant.

Comming starts with 1mil, ends with 1.5mil (slightly more if you use 35% instead of 33%). I guess that is only 25% higher expenses, and with same amount of tech assuming it is more then the minimum the extra 2% a commie gets would not counter it.

This is best case senario.

Mid case is your stuff doesn't sell, you have to use 126 worth the next day after you take it off the market and it does sell. (Only way to avoid this is sell dirt cheap, which also counters how much Enshula says commie's make), and you will end up with about 1.8mil expenses, say a 40% increase in expenses overall.

Now worst case, your stuff doesn't sell, you have that much extra income, before you get it to sell for a lot cheaper then you wanted. And after using your turns, you can only sell 35% of what you have, hence making it so your next day expenses are 20% higher then a reps - at the start, at the end it is double.

Commies are amazing on paper, and if you can know what price something will sell at, while not undercutting you can grow. But all it takes is a simple market flux and you will have massive expenses you have to pay.

I think commies just need a little bit more to fill a niche, and they will still not be played greatly, but will be practical for the roll they fill, hence the cash corruption idea.

Yeah I saw the commie casher aspect of it too, enshula, but it makes a new strategy that isnt much better then any other one, but practical, may work, and people might do it.

If buying and selling is a pain, that only reinforces why commies should get a little advantage there.

he means because if you run a whole days turns your expenses go up before you can sell military

I think it is a good idea, and would actually want me to run a commie as a end game netter. It has a lot of drawbacks, but it would also be more reliable then stocking food or oil. I dont know if it would be great, I don't think so, but it would be fun.

i just meant that as the likely theoretical max commies can make, perhaps before the last few days if your jumping late for some reason

the advantage though is its a lot easier to get a lot bigger quicker

your income is much higher than anyone else before tech investment usually

Commie's are great at start, I will admit. But all their bonuses, gov bonus for indu, tech bonus, also increase their expenses by that much too. So once you get to the point where you produce half again your military and sell it, most of your bonuses are countered right away by the expenses. Meanwhile a rep could easily have half the commie's military, and 1/3 of the end expenses and be pulling in as much cash. After you minus expenses from it, commies are pretty bad.

well you probably still have to double sell if you want to do well

but the opportunity is there to get a lot of land quick, particularly in non tag servers where techers cant grow as quickly and tech prices tend to be lower

its probably easy to grab cashers in particular when they are spending a huge proportion of their income on tech

i see you mentioned FFA in the first post, i dont think its too important to tune commie indy for ffa

its more something people do early for retals

the lowest $/acre strat is always going to have problems in FFA and indy has the potential to be that at times

when i used to play tyranny indy in alliance back before all the boosts i found it fine

you just had to know that you planned to switch to farmer and have appropriate bpt and start building farms at the right time then it wanst an issue

the indy phase to say 10k acres got me in t10 land for the server then i just rebuilt it gradually depending on how much i could grab

and i seem to recall 1a sets where jets/turrets were 80, you just waited it out then switched when you could get tech or food rose

I know what you are saying, but it isn't tuning Commine indy for ffa, it makes pretty much no difference on all the other servers the 2bil cash corruption on a commie. But for FFA this would make it playable as a strategy.

This doesn't take away from most of commie's bad points, it just adds a good point too, so it can overstock on cash in case stuff doesn't sell, without a penalty.

You know you were awake for a while if you didn't sleep for 2 days before making this thread :/

Idea has merit. Can communism justify it... no. It will only really help commie cashers at best... which is like a kick in the butt for a republican.... aka, get more def or ill farm yah. AND that is the way it should be. Defenses or Land, one or the other.

How about just reducing the military expenses for commies (at least in some games) since that seems to be the bigger issue? That fits with the lore since communist governments pay their citizens poorly (unless the citizens are corrupt and exploit the system which is a good enough reason not to remove corruption for commies) and produce cheap weapons.

I think the corruption should not be equal to that of Food. Food is worth at least 32 times cash, and upwards of 60-65 times at points in the set. I don't see why you should be penalize cash so much more than food, but if you still do, I think cash should only decay at like 1/20 the rate of food. This way it is worse to have cash but not detrimental.

My commies in FFA, all explore, make almost 2bil cash worth of military a day. To spend it on food to keep that on market, then sell food later gives an immense loss for having too much cash. On the other hand, keeping cash on hand jacks up your cash lost per turn enormously.

If commies could keep more cash without a big penalty they would be in a lot better situation.

How is that a problem just with a commie? My cashers make much more than 2B per day and I need to stock food in the middle of my turns :-P That occurs in any well played country IMO