thank you very much slagpit
i was honored to have me name invoked last set and to have an entire set devoted to me was a blast
i enjoyed playing again

i feel a little guilty about not playing a dictator after pleading with you for so many weeks to fix the gov type but i wanted to try out your new commie techer, well new to me anyway

congrats to greggarious gregg for a huge score
well done

thanks again slagpit, qzjul and pang



thanks again

i am pleased and honored to have a set of express named after me.
i was surprised and honored when i was informed by mass email that there was going to be a set where all the names were to be tailored after the villainous ESC and me. this extra honor is even greater.

i told myself and that guy you sent to my office that i would never play again because there was no reason to continue. i will play this set because it would be ingracious, unvirtuous and LaExious to snub such an honor.

the suggestion of tailoring the rules to fit my vision for the game is an additional reason for me to play

if you are willing and it is not too hard to code for gregg's server

-no drop land rule waived
-unlimited spy ops
-spy ops steal cash, tech, food and aircraft but do not blow anything up
-dictators can stage raids where they grab no land only booty
-if your SPAL is lower than your target's then your odds of winning are below 5% everytime

if that is too hard i understand


again thank you slagpit for this honor
and thanks to my biographers who have kept my name ringing even though i have retired

and refused to pay for his kid's college education

a refusal that has rippled with collateral damage to this site

stop caring, gregg

even if with your education and experience you managed to help fashion a community-accepted enforcement policy that held cheating to a minimum.

Would that stop an innocent client from going to jail?

stop caring, gregg


Gregg, you stopped playing the game and thinking of development ideas to try to stop corruption. Understandable that is who you are but of the four people who indicated they agree with you, three quit the game. what does that tell you?

even if you watched the forums grow into a marketplace of ideas rather than a dumping ground of lies, what pang aptly describes as the whines of five year olds and schoolyard insults.

Would that solve the hospital's intractible illegal alien problem?

stop caring, gregg

Even if wih the new ideas pang managed to turn this game from a failing ember of a 1980s idea into a vibrant 21st century game

Would that reverse the museum's dwindling membership?


stop caring, gregg.
good advice, Twain thanks. you have freed me from this insidious game. If you ever see me back on forum or like some poor sick tweaker playing this game again please remind me of this conversation. As a gesture of appreciation i offer you a tip, do not give the same advice to pang.

He might take it too.

Gregg stop caring

Pang has said if he has to spend a bunch of time policing cheating he will close the site, the solution is to force pang to spend hours upon hours policing a group that feels entitled to cheat

am i the only one who can foresee the inevitable result?

please enlighten me as to why this is a shortsighted idea while deletions of countries which have already served their purpose is such a brilliant all encompassing solution?

twain it is all of our responsibility to fight evil
it is a duty of citizenship in any community

as to people only posting to laugh

that is how jiff got started he laughed at my posts

then he thought about it and thought about it
and realized i was right

what i am trying to do is prevent cheating

i am not failing any more badly at that than earth 2025 and this site are doing

and as to the idea of making multiple countries on Express to fight LaE on the Express set, I have of course considered it,

but

I believe that cheating is morally wrong, that puts me in the minority but i will not fight their multis with my multis

as far as recruiting others guys like jiff and altair have said they would just quit playing EE instead of fighting LaE

yes Havoc, NOW3P is in charge of the clan for LaE on Express.

There are no ingame tags but he has told us many times that as the set is running he tracks which LaE members play which sets using which strats and under which names on that server. He coordinates any retals the clan needs to make and plans the end set strategy for NW victory for one of their players. He coordinates the ingame messages and the forum posts for trying to locate and kill clan enemies. They send ingame messages threatening sanctions in LaE ffa if you do not obey the clan strategy in Express.
In fairness they like to be called friends and have repeatedly said that twenty friends acting in unison is not a clan. Recently Mr Ford and Thunder have indicated that they will help with coordinating NOW3P's efforts

The reference to cheating for years relates to their own statements on the alliance server that they routinely cheated on Earth2025 over a long period of time

all right still another guy who agrees with me

no

not sure who he is

there are people besides me on this server who oppose cheating

you tell me how to transfer a quote from ffa to express and i will be happy to

people have read pang's quote in ffa

i have quoted it here on express

your brazen lies have been exposed


I have been shouting LaEx cheats since long before the deletions, you know that. anyone who wants to check the dates can verify that.

You claim you are cleaning house but you just keep lying?

i am beginning to think Llaar and jag are still more trustworthy than you and NOW3P

pang says more than four people cheated
jag says more than four people cheated

You expect us to believe you do not know who hit your top netter?

ok you only play in LaE and LaEx i will not talk to you about NA any more

i bet it is fun
it has been fun destroying your once proud clans

so now we have heard from the official spokesperson of LaEx

His response? part lie, part whine, part misspelled insult
the usual

They can not fashion a reasoned argument as to why they do not deserve a real deterrent

The good of the game must take precedence over what is good for LaE, NA and LaEx.

deletions have been happening since 1999 they will never stop

more importantly they will never deter cheating

from 11 years experience we know this penalty is inadequate
insanity is doing the same thing over and over nd expecting a different result

a great game designer lost his dream because he could not figure out how to stop people from cheating

that makes me sad

yet another software designer is disillusioned with his dream because he can not stop cheating

cheaters will always be with us
we can never stop them

we can stop people from indirectly benefitting from cheating

LaE and LaEx want to play by their own rules
give them what they have earned

they told us why they cheated

they have always cheated, always

pang told us more than 4 cheated so drop that lame argument

no one in LaE is above suspicion
thats not me thats the guy who knows you all very well

jag is still on the primary so stop lying about him leaving the game

i am not sure why you are the face of LaEx but you are not doing your three clans any favors with lies whines and insults
you asked me questions which i answered
i asked you questions and you will not answer them
your new leader comes on and challenges me to a debate and then ducks out

you want a debate lets debate pick a time and i will go head to head with thunder

there is no such thing as a legitimate LaE, NA or LaEx net worth win

any player that is the indirect beneficiary of cheating is tainted

if everyone knows they are LaEx they dont hit them
if only you know they are LaEx that still taints them because no one in your clan will hit them and you protect them against assault
you have told us many times you keep track of which LaEx is playing this set so do not try to deny it now

last set was a perfect example
i hit C R O A T I A early and he threatened me with massive retal
NOW3P knows that is true but those of you who are not LaEx may need to check eestats to verify it

anyone who has played here knows that C R is a peaceful netter who thrives under the blanket of the evil shadow clan

so what did he mean by massive retal?
he could not have meant by him he could only have meant by LaEx

so to gather even more evidence as if i needed it I told him my country was not Gregg and lo and behold no retal
so he called off the retal

LOL
u guys r still cheating even now

you can not stop
you can not help yourselves
you are compelled to cheat
i get it i accept it i will try to stop you

ok we have heard the insults and ADD grunts from LaEx's allies

if LaE were a woman would you keep taking her back? and harbor the delusion that she wont cheat?

i understand it is dangerous to speak out against LaEx
I understand when you do they will look for you on every server and kill you as they have me

If the mods just lay down for LaE and their sister clans then you will be punished for supporting me on the boards

but if the site cowers before LaE on this issue then the site is destined to fail anyway

Pang and the ffa and express mods,

LaE and their Express server clan, LaEx, have played by their own rules for years.

The best way to stop people from playing by their own rules is to tailor rules specific to them.

So for the next two resets in FFA and express


No LaE or LaEx country is protected by spy DR . Let the victims of the cheating impose justice for clandestine cheating with spy ops. It's fitting.

when either of the two clans launch a missile there is a 10% chance it will explode on the launch pad impacting their own country and a 5% chance it will veer off course and impact a clansman

when LaE and LaEx get hit by an earthquake it is not 2.3 on the Richter scale it is Haitian sized killing 12% of the population and wiping out thirty percent of the buildings.
They have played by their own rules, now let them live with them.

The people who do not cheat will no longer defend, condone and empower the cheating if instead of benefitting indirectly from the cheating they are suffering these direct consequences.

Thanks for your efforts and your consideration.

duh

thanks for straightening me out azz

u r right

Hello thunder
congrats on your new position

It is unfortunate that your first comment ever to me is an insult but i will let it pass
let us see if we can get a dialogue going
although neither NOW3P nor fordie were capable of it

they both practiced ad hominem slurs and were deliberately obtuse so i regret that your first comment directed to me was an insult because it bodes ill and is reminiscent of their posts

I welcome the opportunity to speak directly to a thoughtful LaE leader. apparently you are capable of nuanced thought a quality not present in the gentlemen i have been arguing with for weeks

I will acknowledge your point that Pang did not specifically point to LaE as the cause of his disillusionment but given the context of his statement the implication was clear.

I know you are busy with your new duties and battling the spreading NA scandal so i will try to be brief.



if you really intend to clean house please investigate the allegations on this server
please acknowledge that if some in your clan shared countries and illegal multis on two other servers they might well have done it here as well


As someone else posted it seems unimaginable that with me raising a ruckus for weeks on the forums that they would continue cheating
Once we had proof that they were playing multis and sharing information on this server two of the cheaters got scared off playing this server according to NOW3P
but they kept cheating on the other two servers

if someone is screaming "LaE cheats LaE cheats
and i sent proof to the mods"
why did they keep right on doing it?
Why didnt it get reported to the top of the clan and investigated?
Why did your new third in command not investigate the allegations but instead launch into a smear campaign? You could have caught the cheaters internally and avoided this whole scandal. Sorry i apologize this is not about his past errors it is about your future conduct. From now on, if someone says LaE is cheating have a protocol to investigate it.

You have inherited a cesspool, sir, and i doubt if there are many men who can clean it up.

You have read that cheating is endangering the whole game and you seem to agree.
I doubt if you have had time to read all my posts and probably only have sketchy reports from men who dont quite grasp the concepts therein but


Knowing that cheating is threatening the game please
acknowledge that you do not yet have all the facts and order your lieutenants to stop defending the clan until after all the facts are in and the remedies in place
order them to stop smearing a guy who only has the best interest of the game at heart. This is a time for humility not arrogance. Whoever your damage control specialist is he is failing, frankly you should bring in an old enemy to be your clan spokesperson and internal investigator. Even Toyota did a better job of damage control than your underlings are doing. voluntarily impose some restrictions on your clan
as a self discipline for the past scandal
and for the scandal still developing on alliance

NOW3P has the embarassment of having stated for weeks that there was no cheating and then having to eat his words
It should have been a cause of great sadness when this scandal broke but because of the smear campaign led by NOW3P and participated in by many within your clan,
my reaction was elation at having finally been proven right. Some of that may be my fault but much of it was a reaction to having been insulted for weeks.

Avoid that trap and do not defend the indefensible
conduct a thorough investigation of your own clan
not just a whitewash. If heads should still roll cut them off yourself. Stop the practice of LaE insulting those who want a clean game. If you can somehow adopt and enforce these suggestions you will have the gratitude of the whole community and i will post a positive statement about LaE.

they were whining for years before i left swirve and came to this site

I see no indication they will quit

all three LaE and LaEx leaders are bawling on Express forum

and if u follow the alliance forum they are lying and whining over there right this second
trying to make up lies for the second cheating scandal in as many weeks

100% of the LaE and LaEx leadership is posting in Express

it was bad enough when all they did was cheat

now they not only play each others multis

they play each others threads

LaE lies
-pang

yet another example is saying i just started playing

LaEx stop whining like five year olds

Moderating a set of ffa must be a tough thankless job.

First of all thanks for the effort.

You have a lot of responsibility without a lot of help.

I agree with pang not desperado, cheaters all too often prosper at this game. LaE, Na and LaEx are all dominanat on their servers.

if the site closes because people defended, condoned or empowered LaE's conduct, that will affect the alliance server .

Quoting from Pang on the ffa server

"No one in LaE (is) above suspicion"

no news flash there

continuing Pang's quote

"we deleted you before and you all just straight up lied and whined like five year olds... I believe there were more than four involved itn the (cheating)... 3 potentially"
"we were easy on you but when you post this (stuff) it makes me wonder if we did the right thing"

Pang goes on to say that he may shut down the site because of the time required to police LaE

if you log in one day and the site is dead

you will know that LaE has won

Defend this site, condemn LaE, NA and LaEx

I post about LaE on the Express server because their cheating on ffa, alliance and the oher servers endangers the game.

Pang has said that he may close the site because of the time required to fight cheating by LaE, NA and LaEx.

I know some of you may want to defend LaEx but if you do, your run the risk of encouraging them and you may be killing the game itself.

Quoting from Pang on the FFA server

"no one in LaE is above suspicion, we deleted you before and you all just straight up lied an whined like five year olds"

those who read Express posts know who in LaE does that

continuing with Pang's quote,

"We (were) onto you from the start, I believe there were more than four involved in the (cheating), 3 potentially...
We were easy on you all but when you post this kind of stuff it makes me wonder if we did the right thing"

Pang goes on to say that perhaps he needs to shut down the site, due to the time it takes to deal with LaE

If you try to log in some day and the site is dead

you will know that LaE has won


If you defend condone and empower the cheating by LaE, NA and their Express clan, LaEx, you endanger the entire game.
Developments on the ffa and alliance threaten the Express server and that is why I post about LaE on Express

has LaE cleaned house?

Lets see what we know of the new leadership

i know nothing of thunder absolutely nothing

but lets see what we know of the new leaders' character from their posts on servers throughout this site

two men who have vowed to overwhelm the Express server with LaE countries are now the number two and number three leaders of LaE in the ffa

see their posts in the express server

if they keep their word the express server will remain a hotbed of LaE clan activity

does that inspire confidence they will clean house?

The number two guy was specifically named by jag in his rant that jag and his friends will continue cheating for years to come
given jag's post on express that he will continue to play should we trust these leaders to report when he resurfaces?
What of their disingenuous claims that he has left the game?
should we trust them not to just act as puppets for llaar?

the number three guy has been the face and main enforcer of clan activity in the express server for six weeks
the number three guy has told us on the express server that he has kept track of every LaE player on express for the last six weeks
coordinting clan activity on an individual server is cheating and the number three guy has been up to his eyeball in it

if the head of war on ffa is the face of LaE on express should we believe there will not be clan activity on that server?
Now3P has stated that twenty LaE members playing in unison on an individual server does not constitute clan activity

that matters to ffa players because it reflects negatively on their character and honesty

If you want to become familiar with fordie and NOW3P see their numerous posts on the express server
you will not be filled with confidence that they will clean house

it is distressing that on the very day that they assume power in LaE they vow to organize clan activities on Express

The leaders of the other clans on both ffa and alliance should hold a conference to determine how to handle the next LaE cheating scandal; sooner rather than later,

this round is over! You deleted ten countries!

if u did not get to see jag's rant before it was deleted

take a deep breath and get one of your LaE buddies who saved it to read it you

again your problem is not with me
I have no evidence that you are a cheater except for jag's statement
I have evidence you are reckless with the truth and that you should have known what was happening
but jag is the only one who said you cheated.

i understand that objection

No clan should be required to take a cheater

if you are not going to give the player the death penalty

especially in this case where one of them posted that rant which was so disturbing to pang and everyone who read it

shouldnt he at least be sent somewhere where he will be monitored. if u leave him where he is u r just asking for trouble.

i still say delegate enforcement to the players

Mr Ford your problem is not with me

i never said you were a cheater until after jagernacht did

your problem is with him

Delegate enforcement to the players.
Enforcement will be difficult.

However, those of us who read Pang's post that ffa is just too dirty and may not be worth the effort realize that getting this issue resolved is in all of our interests. We do not want a situation where the developers become disheartened with the game.


For the players of any game there is nothing more frustrating than feeling like you are the only one obeying the rules. The perception that enforcement is lax or sporadic or biased leads to more cheating and cheating by people who only do it because they believe everyone else is doing it. If you can start to get a handle on it that perception eases and the expectaion of fair play can be perpetuated.

Ask the clans if there are any clans willing to take each of the cheaters, one clan per cheater. If the clan is willing to do so they become liable for any cheating done under their auspices. This they get a skilled player but they know they have to be watchful of that player.

Your tech guys should easily be able to put a numerical limit on any clan that is under restriction. We can imagine any number of scenarios where clans will cheat. But if the clans have recruit restriction as a tool of enforcement and they set the penalties for each infraction out in advance the clans should be better able to keep themselves clean. The clans can devise other enforcement mechanisms as well. Rome was not built in a day and our disciplinary policy wont be either.

Ask the clans to get together and pass a code of conduct with enforcement built in so that the clans know what to expect and are invested in enforcement. Like any congress they should imagine scenarios which might occur and set out the penalties in advance. This should not prove overly complex because the number of cheat scenarios is not that great in this game. Discipline can be delegated to people other than the admins who as Pang said are trying to improve the game and expand it not constantly monitor the site for cheating. The discipline for second third and fourth offenses are set out in advance by the clans so once again the community is invested in the rules. You could have the clans establish a small pool that reviews the evidence of cheating and renders the penalty. Failure to cooperate would be punishable by preset standards as well.

For individual games, ask the people who played each set if they are willing to discuss ways to keep that server clean. See if you can get a small pool of people dedicated to keeping each server individual server clean.

This will require an investment of time by many people but if a game does not inspire people to work to keep it going then it will fail eventually anyway. This game has proven fairly resilient and there are volunteers ready to help.

Other games which are bigger than ours have similar set ups which work well, Bridge is a good example. In Bridge there are people who started as players who are now just full time rule enforcers and a lot of them do it for free because they love the game.

This pool of volunteers allows the site designers and game theorists to spend time doing what they like and lets the players know that the rules are set in advance of any violation either intentional or unintentional.

Set that up here and you will be surprised with how easily and efficiently you can deal with the next scandal.

i had more fun tracking you guys down and getting a confession than i ever expected to have at this game.
As i was Gsing NOW3P i realized that the game itself does not hold anywhere near as much interest as having tracked and exposed u guys

I wish the confession had specifically implicated NOW3P but it did not

Perhaps NOW3P is in that group of LaE who should have known about the cheating but for whatever reason did not know

Although we proved that LaE cheated here perhaps NOW3P was just a dupe who was too reckless with the truth

again thx for make the game entertaining

that is the point lita

they closed two LaE accounts and killed ten countries here

that is the point

thanks fo posting mr ford

having read jag's confession, do u dispute that u were one of his "friends?"

if u were one of his friends and joined him in his actions as he said, why not come clean and admit it?

we all know what you are

i am not responding to your private message because u were thoughtless and did not include a header


without the header it can not be accessed

i should have known better than to post a joke

humor is lost on this bunch
technically there should be no clan net worth period

surprised that was lost on the responders

but if u have to explain a joke
u have the wrong audience

having won the argument
having read jag's confession
i injected some humor

sorry i should know better than to joke with puter guys

Well last night jag got banned for life and then apparently somehow got reinstated

he was banned for life for about an hour))))

Jag
the thread may have been deleted but plenty of people saw your confession and pang banning u for life

charles i assume that lae had a much higher nw than that on ffa although i dont monitor that server like i do this one

LaE had a clan net worth $4.7 B three sets ago

they would have crushed that this se i they had not lost those ten ountries day one

the Express clan NW record is $4.7 billion held by LaE

now that jag has been banned for life perhaps LaE will finally admit that some cheating occurred

i hope u guys had a chance to read his confession/defiant statement

in light of his statement i can not wait to read mr fords next post)))

this reminds me of the bill clinton saga Now3P is lannie davis and i am kenneth starr

and we finally have not only the blue dress but also the public statement confessing guilt

i have had so much fun following this i havent played my country at all have about 500 turns left
you want to play it for me NOW3P?
just kidding that was not a true request for assitance pursuant to the LaE clan policy of playing each other's countries

pang

ffa has exposed some cheating.
for that reason alone ffa was well worth it.

Please do not view this event as solely an unmitigated disaster, it is also an opportunity to fix your game.
u must use this opportunity though to stop the cheating on all the servers not just ffa.


there are people who have run leagues, there are people who know how to devise remedial actions to prevent future cheaters. i am not talking about the technical puter skills needed to detect multis and bots. i am talking about rules which when posted in advance and known by all can lessen the danger of cheating. You will have to implement these systems eventually anyway, why not now? post a request for volunteers to draft a set of regs and see what they come up with.

NOW3P

Have you read Jag's statement?
Do you believe him when he says he and his buddies have cheated for years and will continue to do so under the umbrella of LaE?
Do you believe him when he identifies Mr Ford among his friends?
Why did you and the cheaters keep track of the LaE members playing on Express even when they were using non=LaE names?
Do you seriously doubt that when the cheaters mistakenly thought i was in LaE they threatened to sanction me for conduct on the Express server?
Are you ready to finally acknowledge that what i have said all these weeks is in fact true?

Mr Ford
do you want to take this opportunity to dispute his claim that he and his friends have cheated for years and will keep on doing so under the auspices of LaE?
Do you dispute being one of those friends?

reading the recent statement by the cheaters saying
yes we cheated
we have cheated for years
and they will never cach us again
but we will keep on cheating

was troubling
no remorse
only defiance


mere deletions are as someone else stated no where near hard enough given their post
caught cheating once is one thing posting that u have done it for years and will keep on doing it is grounds for a permanent ban

and the clan must be restricted otherwise the leaders have no incentive to police their own ranks

Look I have stated previously i wont respond to convicted cheaters

but for those of you reading this thread
their tactics are clear

lie about gregg
say he has only been playing only three months
if u have followed this u know i have played for years on swirve
try to make this about gregg not about LaE
post ADD drivel to make the threads unreadable
post insults in hopes he will stop
pretend they have not read the post about when the Express accounts were deleted
when that post has been up now for over 24 hours with no response but their incessant juvenile chatter
anyone who has read my posts knows that they are lying about me and what I am saying is true

even CRNA, NOW3P, is now down to they probably didnt cheat

what makes it probable that they didnt cheat?

they cheated on ffa
they cheated on alliance
according to NOW3P's earlier post they stopped playing in Express two sets ago after I was telling everyone that LaE was cheating
NOW3P has posted on three separate occassions that he knows which LaE players played which sets on Express
I have stated I bleieve him

PLEASE go back and count them yourself to ensure that i am telling the truth

Three of LaE's top netters and two of their known cheaters
all played the same set and all knew which LaE players were in Express

HE knows who in LaE is playing which set on this server he has told us that three times

he knows the cheaters played on this server on the set where i first accused LaE of cheating

all he can say is yes the cheaters played those sets
yes gregg says they cheated
after Gregg says they cheated and he told the mods the cheaters stopped playing this server,WHY??
and began a campaign of smearing me
yes LaE had ten countries deleted this set
but these known cheaters probably did not cheat?

LaE had ten countries deleted here but there were supposedly only four cheaters involved

what does that tell you?

but we no longer need this business where i present proof and LaE posts nonsense

they have admitted it

i posted earlier that LaE had ten countries deleted on this server at the same time as the deletions on the alliance and ffa servers and i gave the numbers of the countries
so check that post and check the numbers do it before this set closes or you might think i made it up

the mods have said that LaE cheated on multiple servers
not just two but multiple servers

and u can find my posts about LaE cheating on this server going back weeks from the first time i caught them red handed and notified the mods with the ingame proof

i can not imagine why people are still sticking up for these guys given their recent admission that they have been cheating for years on multiple servers

i have been after these guys for weeks and have read all the posts on ffa alliance and here.

if u only read a few posts or only read posts for this server u may not find their admission but look for it

they cheated en masse for years and defiantly say they will keep on doing it