Is that specifically against this ruleset? After all, I thought we were discussing the spirit, not the letter, or the rules.

You have never read the rules have you? Following the spirit of the rules is one of the rules. So yes, it is specifically against the rule set for the server.

I read the rules once. As usual, they slip through my head like sand through the fingers. I am happy enough to admit that. That's why I ask for clarification.

While this means absolutely nothing as far as the old rules set is concerned, I'm sure that (in a completely hypothetical sense) if a new Team server was ever developed from scratch, the current gameplay of this server would be used as an example of how not to do things.

By old rules you mean Earth: 2025 1a which has no bearing on this server? Just because some of the people who play here are transplants from that server does not make this server an attempted reconstruction of that server.

I actually had to look for some time before I found the page with the rules. It could be worthwhile having a link to them a bit more visible.

The old rules have plenty of bearing on this server for that very reason. Not that this logic has anything to do with the point I was trying to make earlier (which, to reiterate, is simply that bringing back the old rules would not be a bad thing), I'll point out that the old rules are the reason that the transplants are here--which is the reason that this discussion is being held in the first place. Like it or not, the present is informed by the past, no matter how badly people want to disassociate themselves from it.

I will happily admit that the new rules are not an "attempted reconstruction." That does not mean that they weren't superimposed on a server that was. That simply leads us into a circular discussion, but it needs to be said.

Logically in a general sense that doesn't mean they weren't superimposed on a server that was - however in this case they weren't superimposed on a server that was. The previous occupants of that server adopted this as their home - their home was not altered to become this.

Also, just because people don't forget their past and base their current views on the past, does not mean that what they had before has any bearing on what is here.

I don't really care enough to understand what y'all are arguing about anymore, but I feel compelled to point out that the first reset, Dec 18, 2009 - Jan 31, 2010, was a Beta of Alliance [From the 5 Dec 09 blog post: "...also, we are still discussing what to do about the Alliance server. (It will generally depend on if there is a demand for it! We realize many people play it, but must also weigh the splitting of the user base)"], meaning the transplants from Earth 2025 did not usurp a server for their own evil purposes and did have, albeit briefly, a home here in Earth Empires. Ergo, old rules cannot be thrown out for the reasons you want them to be because those members were here when the rules changed and were superimposed on a server that already existed in a far different capacity.

Just saying.

Thank you, Viceroy, that's the exact point I'd like to see expressed more often.

And if things hadn't changed since then, then that would be a valid point.

Viceroy's point--what I've been griping about throughout this thread--is as valid because you made this post. Because as Viceroy pointed out, this server WAS altered after we made our home here. Whether or not it was fair can be argued from now until the cows come home, as we've already proven in two threads. But the fact does exist that this was at one time Alliance, and that is why we are here. You can't pretend that it didn't happen that way.

stop pointing out.

Honestly, I can't fathom why you guys are here and not in alliance considering that this server calls for teams of five players...

cause many if not all of them play already at alliance.

Well then I guess they need to decide whether they have loyalty to their alliance server alliance or their group here. Having been here first does not give you squatter's rights. The land is owned by the admins and they have said only five people per apartment.

I think many if not all some teams are from same alliance. they have 5 per team but they also have multiple teams and I don't think rules say anything about not allowing multiple teams.

I suggested when team surfaced that this would be pactless server but ..............

It is against the rules. That is the whole point of this. The spirit of the rules is separate entities - not one unit that has multiple tags.

Just curious, but does this discussion have any practical significance on the server? It was my understanding that no one accepts cross tag retals, and everyone agreed it was super lame when 4 Veng tags ganked DBD for hits that DBD2 made. It was doubly wrong because 4 on 2 on a first strike is pretty silly, but more so because they were cross-warring now. It even seemed like people hoped or expected that RD would be the server police and bring holy retribution on Veng for it (but they didn't).

So I guess my question is, which tags are actually playing as one unit? And furthermore, what does that mean to them? Basically full defense/offense pacts with each of the other teams?

It's basically the same as if the 5 biggest alliances on alliance server FS'd and destroyed one other alliance. Is it within the rules? Probably. Does it ruin the game and drive off players? Definitely. Would it even be fun? Doubtful. Why play in an environment that isn't competitive?


Hmm, to answer my own question, I guess FBI/NSA/CIA or whatever is the only multi-team tag now?

you can't have pacts outside your team (which makes techers life bit miserable).

teams can have pacts and if has 2 or more tags then those are automatically pacted.

To answer your question - yes it has significance for the reasons you just listed.



All groups warring for some non-issue against another group is very much the sort of collusion that is supposed to not occur.



It is not the same as alliance server is uncapped so it is not really within the rules. Teams are allowed to cooperate with one another but not be one entity with multiple branches. All the rest of your points are valid however.




What have FBI/CIA/NSA ever done jointly? If one starts hitting another is certainly liable to join in for their own bloodlust purposes but in my time in FBI we have never planned a kill run or anything around any of those other groups. We certainly don't cross retal or really interact in anyway...

I really don't see what points you're trying to make. Ok, so tech pacts are effectively limited by this... (although you can easily circumvent that by putting techers together in a tag)

Pacting/interacting with other teams is allowed. It is being one unit intrinsically and operating together (for say the purposes of war) that are an issue.

no cross-retalling allowed (cross-retalling is against spirit but dunno if its against written rules) so each team must have 1-2 retallers.

of course teams can pact and if team c fs's team a1 then a1 most likely calls a2 to help.

if teams were strictly limited to having only one 5 members team then there could be more different tags like aaa, ttt, etc but if some tag/ has enuf members for 2 or more teams they pact eachothers and if aaa gets fs'd by zzz then aaa most likely calls eee to help them cause eee belongs to same group and only thing changed is that no more a1 etc tags.

Telling people to choose between this server or Alliance is going to lead to an empty apartment building, based on Marshal's post.

My apologies for bringing this back up a bit late in the discussion; I was away yesterday.

not empty since some play at team only but there would be way less players and teams and if any1 played limited at E2025 couple months before JoltOmac pulled plug you know what this server would look.

By "empty" I was using an exaggeration to make a point. I know there would be some people that would rather stay here than play in Alliance instead, also. But I have a feeling--and I will admit that I have no stats to back this up--that many more people find the situation in Alliance server favorable to this one.

crazy long thread

and will get longer.

This server is not more sustainable as a second alliance server than as a 5 person team server. As you can see by this round's numbers the over-sized teams are shrinking however several smaller teams still exist. Clearly those who are taking this as an opportunity to play as a 5 member team are getting greater enjoyment. That seems more sustainable and more fair.

I have to admit that I'm still learning my way around this site (in that I don't use many links besides "Build," "Market," and "War Room," etc.), so I'm not sure where those numbers would be found. Could you tell me?

at boxcar: reports, alliances you see current numbers.

at ingame: clans, clans ranked by number of members.

http://www.eestats.com/team/tags

In-game you can also do it as Marshal described.

Thank you.