Why not just quit accepting retals?

Hey! Hey! You'll get Ragers away from our whiskey reserves when you pry the cellar keys from our cold dead hands, thank you very much.

we should just tagkill LaF every reset for being retards.

48 hours is superior if you're a land grabbing alliance. 72 hours is superior if you're getting grabbed. If you have the might to set policies to your advantage, and to enforce them, then you set it to what benefits you the most.

Only downside of aggressive landgrab and retal policies: they tend to start wars. I don't say that as a representative of my alliance, or as a threat, just as an observation.

Nasjym : it had nothing to do with that. pretty much every alliance that was strong enough to enforce a landgrab policy had access to a news database long before 72 hours became the standard.

72 hours also gives time for a target to come out of DR for even retals.

In my opinion, the retal window is 48 hours after the guy who got hit logged in and saw it. Of course, I'm just a foot soldier, and have no role in setting policy : )

lmao

not really depending size of attacker and defending alliance.

on topic: how come 48 hrs retal policy can be enforced to 72 hrs retal policy alliances since I thought alliances have free will to choose which time they use?

48 hrs suits well for big tags but not that well for small tags.

since when does anyone have to accept anyones policy? laf has simply said what it will be enforcnig, its up to each individual alliance to decide what they will be doing.

Still doesn't always work though. With only a few people in the alliance, you're basically saying everyone had to run a retal strat for a certain part of the set, and then be completely active during that part of the set.
You're not always going to be able to swing that, especially with newer players, and it means the person hit isn't always going to have the chance to get their land back. A retal isn't just about the clan, it's also the country. Nobody wants to lose thousands of acres every weekend that they can't get back because they have to drive home from college, work, then drive back during that time.

it looks enforcing to me since pang said that if some1 hits laf as retal after 48hrs retalling alliance will/might need to pay reps.

and you could answer my previous question too about max hits inside 24 hrs before getting killed/farmed.

I'd say we should do the same to PDM, but that already happens... :p

All I'm saying is that if retals are made within the 48hr window, I wouldn't expect any problems at all. If it's between 48-72, it will likely become an FR situation.

And to answer some of the other points, about multiple hits and stuff... that becomes an FR situation, and in each one of those is dealt with on a case-by-case basis.

This isn't meant to be bullying, anyone who thinks it is has missed the intent of this change in policy entirely.

QFT.

That matters little, even a 10 member tag should have the capability to retal anyone on the server. If you think about the mechanics of the game and use it no one is retal proof. Its how the game is designd... 3 Offensive allies, weapons tech, PS, etc... Its built to favor the attacker and if you use this to your advantage you "should" be able to retal anyone. Now some clans/players are sub par and may not be able to retal but that doesn't go to say that they should be able to retal.

Its a matter of perspective.

rpottage, frick, even 3 commie indy mostly jetters and a techer should be able to protect your tag all set. And it isnt asking much to have 1 of 4 people online once every 2 days. If you cant have that then get a couple new active members to do it for you and tell them what to do.

Yes it does sound elitist

No it isn't

It is simply a policy change and just the same when LAND:LAND was introduces and when some alliance enforce others such as 1:7 retals.

the problem comes when say LaF jumps 2 PS on a low defense country. that LaF guy buys tons of defense. me as a retaller for my country waits 24 hours for the guy to accept his retal or not. with 24 hours left i cant send 2 PS to get the land back. i would have to do a SS and a PS. you are putting the favor in the attackers hands.

considering the guy is an attacker, you dont attack unless the favor is already in your hands. why should the game favor the attacker when he is the aggressor.

thats my point of view. as attackers we will just start land grabbing the less active so they have that much less time to get a retal

Yes.

Against 1 person, attacked once, it should work.

But retalling practically non-stop all set because they're smaller and constantly attacked by bigger alliances, and you're not going to be able to retal every attack (especially double or triple taps).
And you didn't address the fact that the land is not going to the original country, which hurts that country and will drive players away.

Why does LaF need new policies when game admins are doing it for them?

yah.. because people will sure grab you a ton if you retal every hit for a bit eh? Stop making sad excuses you two -_-

I don't get what dagga's post could be about, but I bet it's an attempt to try to discredit me for some reason!! :p

I ignored him and replied to the other two :P He dosnt seem to care much about trolling anymore. He dosn't do his old good job at it.

I never read this thread so...

"The Supreme Court's precedents on ignorance of law and fact, though scattered and narrowly written, are linked by a common philosophy and have been hailed by previous commentators as an emerging jurisprudence of "mandatory culpability" (Wiley 1999:1023) or "excusable ignorance" (Davies 1998:341). In all of these cases, the Court emphasized the theme of foreseeability or notice, reasoning that if the underlying illegal act is not obviously wrongful, then criminal punishment is not appropriate unless the defendant acted wrongfully by intentionally disobeying the law."

SPEAK TO MY LAWYER!

so you're saying the rules don't count if you're stupid?

This game, its server, and a majority of its coders/administrators reside in Canadian jurisdiction.

Under the Canadian Criminal code, section 17 specifically states that ignorance of the law is no excuse or justification for violation :P

If a tag that does retal well, then people will stop grabbing them, it's not rocket fluffing science.

warlorde, that's where offensive allies come in, you can have 3 of them, and with their help, you can easily break almost anyone in the game as long as

A) You and your allies actually does run a retal-oriented country and strategy.

B) You use your calculator

C) You get up to date spy ops on the target and his allies.


I'm pretty sure you can then get enough jets to break him twice. Oh, you still can't because you spent all your turns farming an untag too? Then your allies, your PARTNERS in retal team, should be able to do it.



Game's not about being fair, game is about being the best they can be at whatever they want it to be, some focus on netgaining, some focus on winning wars against others, and some just likes to run rainbows and try and get in the top 100 with it.

Even when the game was at it's best when there were literally thousands of countries playing each day, no one complained about not being able to retal because they were small. If you couldn't retal, then you deserved to be farmed. That was before the military costs decrease introduced here in EE.

It's the same problem with kids today, I was watching Grown Ups last night, and that movie basically tells it how it is. Kids just wants instant gradification now a days, NOW NOW NOW. They don't care about enjoying the little things, they just want high scores, no risk, and no way others can beat them.

I'm not trying to attack anyone or any alliance, and my views are my views, not of LaF.

If someone sucked in DPS in WoW, they get cut by their raiding roster. They fluff about not having a good enough computer, or not having the gears the better players have, or 'lag', or any other stupid reasons, they get laughed off the server.

It's about doing what you can do, with what you have, and try and do the best with it.

Low membership doesn't mean you can't retal

Sure, you might have to let some retals go, and move on to the next ones. Pick the ones that would benefit your alliance the most, and do those. Maybe let some 30A grab go, because it would be better off to hit the guy that took 300A.

If your alliance can, and will retal as many hits as they can, you WILL notice hits come in less often, I can fluffing gaurentee that.

The real reason the game is dying finally surfaces!

Forgotten

the problem is not being too small. last set i had 12m jets on hand and finished with a 120m NW country. the problem is a PS takes 20 hours... i can only send 1 PS when the member has 24 hours to claim his retal or not. unless of course i just so happen to keep twice as much military as every1 else on the server

You still don't get it.

You shouldn't be the only retal person in your tag.

yes... maybe. but if i can do it all in 72 hours im more happy

ya, if EE was in the states, we'd have gotten a bailout and we'd be golden!

Pang move the server now!

nah, it's an election year now so bailout time is over

I'm just surprised Obama made it so far into his term

RACIST!

Not racist

More like the damn rednecks disappointed me again

Thought there would be at least one good attempt at shortening Obama's term

Why?

Do you really want Biden running the show?

Besides, there were attempts. Problem is that racist rednecks, (the one's who'd try to kill him) also tend to be utter morons, and thus tend to get pulled over by the police for stupid things like speeding, busted tail light, parking illegally, etc.

racist is more like when i was tryin to sell that noose obama used as a swing as a kid

He has tried to do some good forgotten. Its a pity the other side simply says no. I bet if Obama offered to resign theyd be so caught up in no'ing theyd refuse ;)

i wasn't being that serious...........:p

how about I hit you just minutes after you put your stocks on the market and in order to retal me, you'd have to use the recall button? how about that? I run war countries and this LAF decision doesn't affect me, but this is seriously damages our all-x netters. So far...in the thread we, the leaders of NA, made on Boxcar, none of our membership is agreeing with a 48 hour rule and after reading this thread all I can say is: If LAF is trying to enforce anything, they must have made peace also with the consequences that this decision brings. May I remember you guys that:
1. You had 25 members before, you can achieve the "experience" again.
2. A 60 member clan CANNOT, like EVER, enforce a rule for a server 10 times bigger.
3. A 48 hour retal rule has been tried before and failed "successfully"

A question, just for my own soul: are you that sure on the capacity of your membership to do well in this situation? Are they THAT capable to enforce a rule for 600 users of this server? :)

Detox (Senate)
Internal Affairs

[Edit] Moo to you too

That sure sounds like quite the threat there dude. Great idea to put on AT by a senate member.
But most of your members don't have the knowledge to comment on decisions like that so i'd not waste time posting a thread about it. How does it damage your all explore netters? You have other people to retal for them, or they can likely get the jets if they really want it. Any landgrab period will not be good for an all explorer. A week wouldnt be any more efficient to do 1 retal.

1. Most of them will want to get their land back
2. The decision of NA members was 100% against the 48 hour rule "enforced" by laf
3. It was no threat, I am stating the facts. You cannot "enforce" anything on anyone. You have to have the majority to take a decision. NA (through me or anyone else) didn't make a threat, just delivered its stand on this matter, but laf when it made this decision like that, threatened anyone: "We enforce something, whatever (could have been buying 1 troop off the market) and you, the plebe, have to obey because we're the big bad wolf." Dude...lessons in politics are learned in a hard way. If the phrase had the turn "What do you guys think? Wouldn't it be better if... whatever, something (don't care really)" you might have obtained the majority of the votes, but since you put it this way... ;) I think you guys are stating the fact that you are ready to go to war for this and need a reason.

We will respect our memberships' opinions and if a retal might happen over a 48 hour period, meh...I guess you guys would have to take then a decision. Our stands:
0 - 48 hours in which the member takes his own retal
48-72 hours in which anyone else in NA can take the retal for that country.

it's not just about the time to build up the offense to make the retal. It's also about timing the hit to avoid DR and do the most damage possible to the offending party. Retaliation isn't a deterrent unless you make it hurt.

As far as threats go, any time you change a standard and attempt to enforce something more stringent, there will be blow back. Especially in an environment where several alliances would rather fight than netgain. The only question is, will the alliance(s) you engage have the firepower to hurt you.

If you hit me just after I send my stock to the market, I would then get your spy op, your allies op, then judge whether it's worth it to retal you myself, or send it to my retal team, and they would break you in about 3 hours.

Detox, you might want to check with your other 'leaders' because from what I know, NA has accepted LaF's 48 hour policy. But I'm just an IA guy, what do I know.

And if you are threatening to challenge the 48 hour rule and have some exchanges with LaF countries, I am more then welcome to retal you, because we will always come out ahead.

1) Yes, we were down to 25 before, but our core has not changed much since the start of EE, through recruitment, I have established a strong base of newbies who, I might add, have had some strong finishes in the past two resets. But unlike other alliances, we have old retired members who come back every reset like clockwork, atleast one or two show up and join back for a reset or two.

2) That is your opinon, and I can tell you that there is more then just LaF that is pushing for this 48 hour retal window. As other alliances have publicly stated they are for it also.

3) Was it the same group that tried it? Nope. You cannot compare other alliances with LaF.

I'm more then comfortable with our retal and war abilities if that situation arises to enforce a 48 hour retal window policy. It is not up to me, however, to say anything more.

lol your wrong about NA accepting the 48hr retal :)

Who tried 48h retals in the past?

Also Detox is an idiot.

Precisely. So what are you doing here shooting your mouth here on FR stuff?

None of our FR's are loud enough!

I'm not, I'm only discussing the merit of 48 hour policy alone and when he talks about interclan relations I pointed him to FR

Torment you got issues with me, we can talk about it privately


fluff this game I'm quitting AT