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mrcuban Game profile

Member
1103

Oct 29th 2014, 22:46:03

I have emailed about this to the mods with no reply.. So i will post here. Can someone please PM with which Game mod purpled 2 TITANS countries and why after 5 sets this was not done in any of the previous sets? I have played with these 2 'members' for over 4 - 5 sets without ANY issues. To be deleted MID set, directly after we had issues with an EVO member, seems a little odd to me. Any update, I don't need a public PM fest here, a PM from a mod with details i would appreciate that. After taking 4 - 5 sets building up relations, i don't need this tarnished for something i have no information or idea as to why...

In the interest of keeping the little community left, I would of appreciated an email or heads up with the info/evidence beforehand.

crest23 Game profile

Member
4666

Oct 29th 2014, 22:49:43

'have' not 'of'.

You need to kick fazer aka Furious off our team, that will take care of the deletions.
The Nigerian Nightmare.

Untagged Hunter

Member
452

Oct 29th 2014, 22:51:05

Don't mess with evo, tella will delete you all. lol

iccyh Game profile

Member
465

Oct 29th 2014, 22:51:17

You don't need your reputation tarnished, but you're willing to come onto AT and slime the game mods by suggesting they favour Evo?

Do unto others and all that...

Untagged Hunter

Member
452

Oct 29th 2014, 22:52:24

And yes, get rid of fazor

mrcuban Game profile

Member
1103

Oct 29th 2014, 23:57:59

No slime intended. I simply stated the situation how it has unfolded and all i know. I am simply asking for communication as i have not yet received any reply for the correct channel. I have requested nicely and used manners.

Home Turf Game profile

Member
798

Oct 30th 2014, 0:20:43

yes you have Cuban, dpnt let em bust your chops bud
HT

Collzaboration Game profile

Member
1038

Oct 30th 2014, 0:25:45

https://www.youtube.com/...ailpage&v=lDQwewROGLA

iccyh Game profile

Member
465

Oct 30th 2014, 0:29:22

...and then you came on AT and ruined all of the patience and politeness you'd previously used.

Seriously, why do you think this is the appropriate forum for game moderation related stuff?

Furious999 Game profile

Member
1452

Oct 30th 2014, 0:42:20

The mods in Express are trying the idea of a short post setting out the reasons/evidence for a deletion. Might be an idea worth looking at for the Alliance server.

elvesrus

Member
5053

Oct 30th 2014, 0:52:11

Originally posted by Furious999:
The mods in Express are trying the idea of a short post setting out the reasons/evidence for a deletion. Might be an idea worth looking at for all servers.


FTFY
Originally posted by crest23:
Elves is a douche on every server.

mrcuban Game profile

Member
1103

Oct 30th 2014, 0:53:56

iccyh - your replies in relation to my posts are never positive or helpful in any way. If i said the sky during a sunny day without any clouds was blue, you'd say I was wrong and it was purple. If even went to the troulble of paying you a compliment, you'd still disagree with me for the sake of not agreeing with anything i had said, regardless if your opinions are wrong. Why do i think its appropriate to post on the alliance server board about the alliance server...hmm do i need to answer that.

We can close this forum post if a mod is here, i don't see this going in any positive direction.But if your here to close the post perhaps someone can reply via pm to my request. I would appreciate that. Thanks

KoHeartsGPA Game profile

Member
EE Patron
29,595

Oct 30th 2014, 1:16:10

Doesn't TITANS consist of the Russian cats that run the multis in mars2025???
Mess with me you better kill me, or I'll just take your pride & joy and jack it up
(•_•)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W6VRMGTwU4I
-=TSO~DKnights~ICD~XI~LaF=-

S.F. Giants 2010, 2012, 2014 World Series Champions, fluff YEAH!

Over The Hill Game profile

Member
509

Oct 30th 2014, 1:28:49

Originally posted by Furious999:
The mods in Express are trying the idea of a short post setting out the reasons/evidence for a deletion. Might be an idea worth looking at for the Alliance server.


stfu fazer

Viceroy Game profile

Member
893

Oct 30th 2014, 1:31:19

I have lobbied long and hard for transparency. Just look at all the rumor, innuendo, complaints, and confusion surrounding this particular instance. Are you telling me that a simple statement stating the why's behind the action would really cause the situation to deteriorate more than it already has?
And, Monsters, do not forget to specify, when time and place shall serve, that I am an ass.

Viceroy Game profile

Member
893

Oct 30th 2014, 1:31:57

Originally posted by Over The Hill:
Originally posted by Furious999:
The mods in Express are trying the idea of a short post setting out the reasons/evidence for a deletion. Might be an idea worth looking at for the Alliance server.


stfu fazer
Wow, that was totally called for. Thank you for your worthwhile addition to the conversation.
And, Monsters, do not forget to specify, when time and place shall serve, that I am an ass.

iccyh Game profile

Member
465

Oct 30th 2014, 1:44:37

Originally posted by Viceroy:
I have lobbied long and hard for transparency. Just look at all the rumor, innuendo, complaints, and confusion surrounding this particular instance. Are you telling me that a simple statement stating the why's behind the action would really cause the situation to deteriorate more than it already has?

On the alliance server it probably is best to keep the game moderation stuff well away from this forum, as no matter what people are going to accuse the mods of bias or conspiracy. Why force them to have to come to the forums to deal with that?

The other two issues are that providing useful information may require revealing player personal or identifying information that the community at large doesn't need to know and should not have, and that explaining the reason for a deletion also risks revealing the methods used to track cheaters.

All in all, it is a losing situation for anything related to game moderation to be posted here, and I hope to see as little of it as possible.

iccyh Game profile

Member
465

Oct 30th 2014, 1:47:16

mrcuban: Positive? No, I'll agree with you there, my responses to you are rarely positive. Useful? That's a very different question altogether, and I can't help but think your reset may have been easier if you'd learned something from our last conversations.

Really though, posting to AT about this makes you look like a hypocrite when you talk about not wanting your reputation smeared, but are willing to insinuate that the mods are favouring one tag or another.

tellarion Game profile

Member
3906

Oct 30th 2014, 1:48:00

Two things for you:

1) Martian is the moderator of alliance server. Any questions regarding deletions should be directed to him. There is also an ingame appeals process, so please make use of that as well.

2) regarding furious' comments, I'd just like to point out that I'm an express mod :P

Viceroy Game profile

Member
893

Oct 30th 2014, 1:54:02

There will always be accusations of bias and conspiracy as long as the mods act in secrecy. We see this now. By stating their case first, they control the narrative and take out the legs of those who would otherwise accuse them of impropriety.

Further, transparency would benefit everyone on this server. It would turn cheaters into the social pariahs they should be. It would serve as cautionary tales in cases of accidental or inadvertent rule violations. In some cases, such as the whole "spirit of the server" situation going on over in Team, nobody - and this includes the moderators - knew for sure how to enforce the new rules when they were first issued. You cannot have confusion when it comes to enforcement of the rules, and transparency ensures that no confusion can persist.

I'm not necessarily asking to be shown the inner workings of the clock, but everyone deserves to see the face so we can read the time.
And, Monsters, do not forget to specify, when time and place shall serve, that I am an ass.

ironxxx Game profile

Member
EE Patron
1108

Oct 30th 2014, 1:56:37

interesting metaphor

i was very easily able to envision a clock swirling around with all kinds of gears protruding from it

well maybe it was an acid flash back

iccyh Game profile

Member
465

Oct 30th 2014, 1:58:12

Why should the mods care what the narrative is? Why should they make the effort to try to convince people who are predisposed to doubt them? Does it somehow make the game a better place to see mods working fruitlessly to convince people who refused to be convinced?

If the cheaters are banned from game, that's really all that matters. They can bluster all they like about things being unfair, but with no game to play they'll leave and be forgotten before long. That's the same outcome as what you're describing, except with significantly less drama.

Viceroy Game profile

Member
893

Oct 30th 2014, 2:04:39

Cheaters actually get banned from this game? Most of them don't even get banned for a full reset.

Not that any of us have a way to confirm any of this other than what our eyes happen to see and mere speculation.
And, Monsters, do not forget to specify, when time and place shall serve, that I am an ass.

iccyh Game profile

Member
465

Oct 30th 2014, 2:13:48

That's how it should be. Game moderation shouldn't be on the forums because it isn't something that should be up for debate or discussion.

Very few cheaters ever own up to it if they're caught, their reply is almost invariably "the mods are biased" and putting posts up on the forums only encourages them to come tell (lie) about their side of the story. This is less true on other servers where accusing mods of bias is more difficult given that they've no reason to care, but is far too easy on the alliance server given the history the mods and admins have with particular alliances.

As far as I know, all of the game mods are volunteers and having done a little bit of moderation and having been peripherally involved with this sort of thing in other games, my experience is that it is a thankless, tiresome job. I don't know why they'd want to invite people to judge their decisions any more than they already do.

Viceroy Game profile

Member
893

Oct 30th 2014, 2:27:09

The easiest way to prove there is no moderator bias is to allow the mods to showcase the good work they do. We already judge harshly what we think they do. Let them shape the narrative before trolls like me can accuse them of any impropriety.

Moderation is a public service. If it isn't public, then it provides a disservice.
And, Monsters, do not forget to specify, when time and place shall serve, that I am an ass.

iccyh Game profile

Member
465

Oct 30th 2014, 2:41:25

You've mentioned narrative twice now, but still haven't answered why the mods should care about narrative. They're not accountable to us, they're accountable to the admins.

As far as public service goes, defense is also a public service but for the good of the nation there are things that are classified which the public is not told. Simply because something is a public service does not mean everything about it is public knowledge.

Viceroy Game profile

Member
893

Oct 30th 2014, 2:48:52

So the mods are fine with crackpot conspiracy theorists making fluff up about how they mismanage their game? Some of their arguments may actually be convincing from time to time... This doesn't damage the game?

The far better comparison for mods are the police, not the intelligence community. We need people in a position to serve and protect. We don't need a secret police, nor do we need James Bond.
And, Monsters, do not forget to specify, when time and place shall serve, that I am an ass.

iccyh Game profile

Member
465

Oct 30th 2014, 2:55:57

More damaging would be the mods giving them attention by responding to them. I doubt the mods are fine with it, but the least bad choice is to ignore the fools who push the conspiracies.

In the justice system, it isn't the police who are put on trial in public and that's what you're effectively proposing when you ask them to justify their actions on the forums.

Getafix Game profile

Member
EE Patron
3423

Oct 30th 2014, 2:59:37

James Bond would raise the level of discussion to a more civilized level, before he blew away the cheaters with his Beretta and went for a double martini. And it would be quite transparent when they release the movie.

Furious999 Game profile

Member
1452

Oct 30th 2014, 3:03:48

I am sure there is merit in some of the arguements against explaining decisions.

And if it were burdensome I would certainly be against it. The mods give their time and the amount of time needed must be kept modest.

But if it turns out to work well on Express I can't see that Alliance is any different. In fact there will be more interest on Alliance, evidence MrCuban's concerns in this thread. Clanmates are bound to be interested and concerned that their own reputation may be tarnished by association.

It seems to me the idea could be tried. As I said on Express, if experience shows that it causes more controversy and bad feeling than it prevents then the idea can be abandoned.

Warster Game profile

Game Moderator
Primary, Express, Tourney, & FFA
4172

Oct 30th 2014, 3:08:46

As the people that play express have seen, I made post with the reset number, country deleted and with only the reason , no evidence or anything in a closed thread

Personal I won't respond about deletions if people post on the forum, if people wish to discuss it they can, if they want to talk to me about it they have the option to message me
FFA- TKO Leader
Alliance- Monsters

MSN
ICQ 28629332

elvesrus

Member
5053

Oct 30th 2014, 3:14:07

What hasn't been brought up yet is damage to a tag due to deletions. Language deletions are a lot less damaging than 1 person running 2 countries, but without a stated reason only the worst is assumed.
Originally posted by crest23:
Elves is a douche on every server.

bstrong86 Game profile

Member
2482

Oct 30th 2014, 12:30:00

Ive always felt that the reasons should be made public. It stopssenseless accusations and pointless threads
The Death Knights

XI

bstrong86 Game profile

Member
2482

Oct 30th 2014, 12:30:05

Double
The Death Knights

XI

Requiem Game profile

Member
EE Patron
9092

Oct 30th 2014, 14:32:42

I think if someone is deleted when they log in it should say why they were deleted.

Shrugs.

Trife Game profile

Member
5817

Oct 30th 2014, 14:50:21

I think if someone gets deleted they should see a picture of tubgirl/lemonparty/meatspin/picture of ZEN, upon login.

Akula Game profile

Member
EE Patron
4106

Oct 30th 2014, 15:00:20

picture of ZEN ... man, thats cruel, unusual punishment ! ;)

*slaps Trife around a bit with a dead squirrel*
=============================
"Astra inclinant, sed non obligant"

SOL http://sol.ghqnet.com/
=============================

Viceroy Game profile

Member
893

Oct 30th 2014, 16:13:34

Originally posted by Requiem:
I think if someone is deleted when they log in it should say why they were deleted.

Shrugs.
The fact that they are not even informed is embarrassing and wastes needless time in the appeals process.
And, Monsters, do not forget to specify, when time and place shall serve, that I am an ass.

tellarion Game profile

Member
3906

Oct 30th 2014, 16:18:02

Originally posted by iccyh:
Why should the mods care what the narrative is? Why should they make the effort to try to convince people who are predisposed to doubt them? Does it somehow make the game a better place to see mods working fruitlessly to convince people who refused to be convinced?

If the cheaters are banned from game, that's really all that matters. They can bluster all they like about things being unfair, but with no game to play they'll leave and be forgotten before long. That's the same outcome as what you're describing, except with significantly less drama.


You know, a few months ago, myself and the other mods were accused of abusing our powers. Martian did a full investigation and posted his results publicly, and people said he was lying and covering fluff up. Even MONTHS later, and people were still saying that they knew the 'true' story, and martian was just corrupt. If that's how everyone reacts to transparency...yikes.

That being said, I'm with warster.

VicRattlehead Game profile

Member
1510

Oct 30th 2014, 17:27:00

Originally posted by Getafix:
James Bond would raise the level of discussion to a more civilized level, before he blew away the cheaters with his Beretta and went for a double martini. And it would be quite transparent when they release the movie.


Walther PPK you philistine.

Requiem Game profile

Member
EE Patron
9092

Oct 30th 2014, 17:31:42

tellarion, would you not agree that if someone is deleted simply putting a "reason" upon login would go a long ways in being transparent?

Furious999 Game profile

Member
1452

Oct 30th 2014, 18:01:54

If it is done - giving grounds - Warster's post shows the way to go. The mod concerned does not get dragged into the arena and start responding to crap on AT. He or she just posts in a locked thread what caused the deletion. In as short and simple a way as his or her time allows them to compose.

Warster's first go at giving grounds on Express runs to 12 words and gets the job done just fine.

Edited By: Furious999 on Oct 30th 2014, 18:04:38
See Original Post

timmie Game profile

Member
211

Nov 6th 2014, 8:24:07

Still no update? I think its pretty sad. Its been over a week since the deletions with no PM or ingame message with a reason. The sites only operates cause people still play. I understand and respect that game mods or admins put there own personal time into the game. The players do as well. I have spent hours on my country, and for what?

Martian please reply to my PM's. Thank you

KoHeartsGPA Game profile

Member
EE Patron
29,595

Nov 6th 2014, 18:36:58

Originally posted by KoHeartsGPA:
Doesn't TITANS consist of the Russian cats that run the multis in mars2025???


Multis
Mess with me you better kill me, or I'll just take your pride & joy and jack it up
(•_•)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W6VRMGTwU4I
-=TSO~DKnights~ICD~XI~LaF=-

S.F. Giants 2010, 2012, 2014 World Series Champions, fluff YEAH!

Azz Kikr Game profile

Wiki Mod
1520

Nov 6th 2014, 19:27:18

Originally posted by VicRattlehead:
Originally posted by Getafix:
James Bond would raise the level of discussion to a more civilized level, before he blew away the cheaters with his Beretta and went for a double martini. And it would be quite transparent when they release the movie.


Walther PPK you philistine.


Maybe he's just referring to the pre-Dr. No Bond. I seem to recall he was ordered to trade in a Beretta for a Walther.