why should they be governed by time rather than by supply and demand? the bots *also* over-price things, as well as under-price

I give time, because there's a pattern every set with prices. If you wanted to go by supply and demand, the bots would have to gather all the info given by #express.market or by history tab, to accurate access the best rate.

The current issues with the bots are their underpricing of tech/jets/food.

Each set, they destroy a particular govt/strat., because the bots under-price one another until they crash that market. It happened last set with $99 jets. It then has a cascading effect, causing all indies not to sell their units until the price recovers.

By making food so cheap, you're not only weaking the farming class but you're also strengthening the classes which depend on it so much.

I've made a previous post before:
If you wanted to go by supply / demand then the bots would need to access Market->History->each item

example:

Time start Time end Min sold price Max sold price Avg price Total volume
May 2, 22:00 May 3, 02:00 $135 $142 $139.67 55,630 <--- going off the total volume and using volumes from previous sets
May 3, 02:00 May 3, 06:00 $131 $142 $138.42 61,777
May 3, 06:00 May 3, 10:00 $125 $140 $134.21 51,840
May 3, 10:00 May 3, 14:00 $140 $144 $140.19 151,271 <---- could compensate price based on this sudden increase
May 3, 14:00 May 3, 18:00 $125 $155 $140.41 115,502
May 3, 18:00 May 3, 22:00 $129 $142 $135.10 41,119
May 3, 22:00 May 4, 02:00 $129 $148 $137.86 44,183

Or you could go by average prices to ignore outliers.
Notice in the example above the average prices are relatively the same 134-140 range. The bots should be selling ideally in that range.

My reasoning for the teir system is based on a 'normal' set. Of course the teir system would be far inferior to supply demand, but the supply demand system would require gathering much more data and quite frankly much more programming.

Celphi, I see that your program and math skills are exceptional. You seem to really "get it" when it comes to playing a bot. Unfortunately, like a bot, you will never truly understand love, not real love as we nurture for qzul. What he has birthed from his digital womb is magical and full of surprises. Yes it $hits in your lap occasionally, or costs you lots of money doing retardation, but you learn as you go, both mother and child.

It is now your duty, as a patriotic earth dweller to write the code that will protect these precious annoyances.

If someone hits a bot more than 1 time they get a retal.
Give the bots a chance to use spies. 2 SS=5-10 bomb airbase or banks or Bio.
Make the bots immune to GDI attack restrictions so they aren't abused by KoH or bottom feeding land wh0res.
We players can adapt to adverse markets, its free trade baby!
Its the domestic abuse of our bots that must be stopped!
Enough talk.
Start writing.

I want a comment rich chunk of code in 48 hours.

The programming changes / suggestions i can make are limited to the functions that Qzjul makes. For the security of the game, Qzjul doesn't make all parts of the game visible (which is understandable). All I can do is use the functions which he has made available already. For an example, since Qzjul has the function of Indies making 20% of spies / 20% turrets / tanks, ect... I can manipulate the coding so that each bot type makes a small portion of spies as well. (Ultimately making every bot to make spies) HOWEVER, there are no functions made to adjust the %s on the manage screen., so I cannot adjust the spy production to 100%. Thus a techer would be making 20/20/20/20/20 default, like the indies do already.

The indies should be making primarily jets/turrets.,. but it's not programmed that way.

As for making them attack back,. that would require a function that either calculates the neccessary jets to retal (easy math) or have it spy country and grab the html of each unit as well as weaps tech / govt type., ect. This function doesn't currently exist. So I cannot code it. Only Qzjul can. There's currently no functions for the war room tab. So I can't do anything from that window. Same goes for Spy operations., no functions made for that tab. Maybe something that I can do, is if a spy ops fails, it could instantly buy defense with available money. Though I'm not sure if he has a function that reads news feeds.

Functions that are available are like:
buy units / tech / sell on pm / sell on public / cash button / build whatever / explore / grab data from advisor tab / and that's about it. Anything outside that requires Qzjul.

Note: Make no mistake, Qzjul is far better PHP programmer than I. The only advantage I have over him is the amount of free time. I self-taught myself PHP last year once mrford pointed out to me of the AI project.

Kinda invision it like this:



MAIN MENU / na
ADVISOR / gather data available
MANAGE / na
BONUS / na
PURCHASES / available
BUILD / available
CASH / available
EXPLORE / available
MARKET / available
RESEARCH / available
MILITARY / na
RELATIONS / na
SPY CENTER /na
WAR ROOM / na
MESSAGES / na
NEWS / na
SCORES / na
CLANS / na
SEARCH / na

all the ones 'available' are the ones i can make a bot do,. until he adds the 'na' tabs i cannot go beyond that.

I guess some spies are better than no spies...


function build_indy(&$c){
//build farms
return build(array('indy' => $c->bpt));
}

This function builds indies. (haha, even though he has the comment build farms in there. most likely he just copy pasted this code to each strat and changed the variable)

An immediate fix would be perhaps:
If ($c->bpt =< 50) {
build(array('indy' => $c->bpt);
} else {
build(array('farm' => $c->bpt);
}

With this code added, the bots would only build indys until they reached 50 BPT (180 CS). Then would switch to making farms. This code is for the farmer_strat.php

You'd basically sub out 'farm' for 'lab' for the techer_strat.php file.

This wouldn't make the indies produce 100% spies but it would at least make enough indies to create a base defense and some spies.

You would place the code right after:
that particular's class function was called.

So for the techer class, it would execute after this function:
function build_techer(&$c){
return build(array('lab' => $c->bpt));
}

This nerd is so annoying with his codes. There's a thing called PM. Nobody cares about your codes. Do it in PM.

If these posts are so annoying, as you say, then why read MY threads? To make a generalization 'that nobody cares', is completely false. I've recieved multiple emails from other players asking me to post these sorts of codes on boards.

Learn to use the forums to your advantage:
Huge hint: Originator means person who began thread. Try to use it.

well, i would suggest using the <pre> stuff so that code looks like this:

An immediate fix would be perhaps:

If ($c->bpt =< 50) {
build(array('indy' => $c->bpt);
} else {
build(array('farm' => $c->bpt);
}

use: the square brackets [] around the word pre and /pre like this

 stuff!

and yea, i'd probably make it check if less than 1 BPT of indies was built, and if not, build them!

Also set spies to 100%, but i have to write the manage code for that still

I recommend at least 5% of land made into ICs. The best would be 10%.

Tested pre tag above.

:)

May 8, 16:00 May 8, 20:00 $1 $155 $54.73 3,165,664
May 8, 20:00 May 9, 00:00 $142 $155 $154.10 880,792
May 9, 00:00 May 9, 04:00 $155 $249 $222.15 1,387,895
May 9, 04:00 May 9, 08:00 $248 $255 $250.01 478,679
May 9, 08:00 May 9, 12:00 $19 $256 $138.15 782,651

Can you tell us Qzjul who is selling oil at $1 and $19? And why don't they get banned? This exploit occurs every set.

The one above is oil:

This one is with bushels:

May 8, 17:00 May 8, 21:00 $1 $38 $34.07 34,888,434 <--------------- $1 bushels
May 9, 05:00 May 9, 09:00 $19 $37 $35.28 39,467,121 <-------------- $19 bushels

$1 bushels must be getting autobought by the game I (earf) would think.

standing orders get some of it.

The game auto-buys things below a certain price, so nobody should be able to buy those

Time start Time end Min sold price Max sold price Avg price Total volume
May 13, 04:00 May 13, 08:00 $120 $240 $164.74 49,303
May 13, 08:00 May 13, 12:00 $95 $320 $130.85 79,743

Qzjul-

The bots are buying food at $240 & $320.

[14:32:05] <Market> May/13/2015 06:32:11 -- Bushels -- $120 -- 78 -- SO: No -- Remaining: 30,843 Bushels
[14:32:06] <Market> May/13/2015 06:32:11 -- Bushels -- $120 -- 216 -- SO: No -- Remaining: 30,627 Bushels
[14:32:07] <Market> May/13/2015 06:32:11 -- Bushels -- $120 -- 360 -- SO: No -- Remaining: 30,267 Bushels
[14:32:08] <Market> May/13/2015 06:32:11 -- Bushels -- $120 -- 460 -- SO: No -- Remaining: 29,807 Bushels
[14:32:09] <Market> May/13/2015 06:32:12 -- Bushels -- $120 -- 430 -- SO: No -- Remaining: 29,377 Bushels
[14:32:10] <Market> May/13/2015 06:32:13 -- Bushels -- $120 -- 246 -- SO: No -- Remaining: 28,885 Bushels
[14:32:11] <Market> May/13/2015 06:32:13 -- Bushels -- $120 -- 351 -- SO: No -- Remaining: 28,534 Bushels
[14:32:12] <Market> May/13/2015 06:32:13 -- Bushels -- $120 -- 572 -- SO: No -- Remaining: 27,962 Bushels
[14:36:10] <Market> May/13/2015 06:36:15 -- Bushels -- $120 -- 250 -- SO: No -- Remaining: 27,058 Bushels
[14:36:12] <Market> May/13/2015 06:36:15 -- Bushels -- $120 -- 650 -- SO: No -- Remaining: 26,408 Bushels
[14:36:12] <Market> May/13/2015 06:36:16 -- Bushels -- $120 -- 598 -- SO: No -- Remaining: 25,810 Bushels
[14:41:53] <Market> May/13/2015 06:41:58 -- Bushels -- $120 -- 4,210 -- SO: No -- Remaining: 22,500 Bushels
[14:41:56] <Market> May/13/2015 06:42:00 -- Bushels -- $120 -- 4,210 -- SO: No -- Remaining: 18,290 Bushels
[14:41:59] <Market> May/13/2015 06:42:04 -- Bushels -- $120 -- 4,210 -- SO: No -- Remaining: 9,870 Bushels
[14:42:02] <Market> May/13/2015 06:42:07 -- Bushels -- $120 -- 4,210 -- SO: No -- Remaining: 5,660 Bushels
[14:42:16] <Market> May/13/2015 06:42:21 -- Bushels -- $120 -- 4,210 -- SO: No -- Remaining: 5,660 Bushels
[14:42:19] <Market> May/13/2015 06:42:24 -- Bushels -- $120 -- 4,210 -- SO: No -- Remaining: 1,450 Bushels
[14:44:05] <Market> May/13/2015 06:44:11 -- Bushels -- $120 -- 200 -- SO: No -- Remaining: 1,250 Bushels
[14:44:06] <Market> May/13/2015 06:44:11 -- Bushels -- $120 -- 308 -- SO: No -- Remaining: 942 Bushels
[14:44:07] <Market> May/13/2015 06:44:11 -- Bushels -- $120 -- 340 -- SO: No -- Remaining: 602 Bushels
[14:44:08] <Market> May/13/2015 06:44:11 -- Bushels -- $120 -- 598 -- SO: No -- Remaining: 4 Bushels
[14:44:09] <Market> May/13/2015 06:44:12 -- Bushels -- $120 -- 4 -- SO: No -- Remaining: 0 Bushels

[15:20:08] <Market> May/13/2015 07:20:13 -- Bushels -- $240 -- 252 -- SO: No -- Remaining: 28,501 Bushels
[15:20:09] <Market> May/13/2015 07:20:14 -- Bushels -- $240 -- 252 -- SO: No -- Remaining: 28,249 Bushels
[15:20:10] <Market> May/13/2015 07:20:14 -- Bushels -- $240 -- 280 -- SO: No -- Remaining: 27,969 Bushels
[15:20:11] <Market> May/13/2015 07:20:14 -- Bushels -- $240 -- 264 -- SO: No -- Remaining: 27,705 Bushels
[15:20:12] <Market> May/13/2015 07:20:14 -- Bushels -- $240 -- 261 -- SO: No -- Remaining: 27,444 Bushels
[15:20:13] <Market> May/13/2015 07:20:14 -- Bushels -- $240 -- 296 -- SO: No -- Remaining: 27,148 Bushels
[15:51:17] <Market> May/13/2015 07:51:23 -- Bushels -- $240 -- 270 -- SO: No -- Remaining: 26,878 Bushels
[15:51:19] <Market> May/13/2015 07:51:23 -- Bushels -- $240 -- 329 -- SO: No -- Remaining: 25,752 Bushels
[15:51:20] <Market> May/13/2015 07:51:23 -- Bushels -- $240 -- 468 -- SO: No -- Remaining: 25,284 Bushels
[15:51:21] <Market> May/13/2015 07:51:24 -- Bushels -- $240 -- 567 -- SO: No -- Remaining: 24,717 Bushels
[15:51:22] <Market> May/13/2015 07:51:24 -- Bushels -- $240 -- 720 -- SO: No -- Remaining: 23,997 Bushels
[15:51:23] <Market> May/13/2015 07:51:24 -- Bushels -- $240 -- 1,030 -- SO: No -- Remaining: 22,967 Bushels
[15:51:23] <Market> May/13/2015 07:51:24 -- Bushels -- $240 -- 1,360 -- SO: No -- Remaining: 21,607 Bushels
[15:51:24] <Market> May/13/2015 07:51:25 -- Bushels -- $240 -- 1,665 -- SO: No -- Remaining: 19,942 Bushels
[15:51:25] <Market> May/13/2015 07:51:25 -- Bushels -- $240 -- 2,052 -- SO: No -- Remaining: 17,890 Bushels
[15:52:21] <Market> May/13/2015 07:52:25 -- Bushels -- $240 -- 198 -- SO: No -- Remaining: 18,489 Bushels
[15:52:22] <Market> May/13/2015 07:52:26 -- Bushels -- $240 -- 192 -- SO: No -- Remaining: 18,297 Bushels
[15:52:22] <Market> May/13/2015 07:52:26 -- Bushels -- $240 -- 280 -- SO: No -- Remaining: 18,017 Bushels
[15:52:23] <Market> May/13/2015 07:52:26 -- Bushels -- $240 -- 400 -- SO: No -- Remaining: 17,617 Bushels
[15:52:24] <Market> May/13/2015 07:52:26 -- Bushels -- $240 -- 441 -- SO: No -- Remaining: 17,176 Bushels
[15:52:25] <Market> May/13/2015 07:52:27 -- Bushels -- $240 -- 600 -- SO: No -- Remaining: 16,576 Bushels
[15:52:26] <Market> May/13/2015 07:52:27 -- Bushels -- $240 -- 658 -- SO: No -- Remaining: 12,992 Bushels
[15:52:27] <Market> May/13/2015 07:52:27 -- Bushels -- $240 -- 1,008 -- SO: No -- Remaining: 11,984 Bushels
[15:52:28] <Market> May/13/2015 07:52:27 -- Bushels -- $240 -- 1,260 -- SO: No -- Remaining: 10,724 Bushels
[15:52:29] <Market> May/13/2015 07:52:27 -- Bushels -- $240 -- 1,620 -- SO: No -- Remaining: 9,104 Bushels
[15:52:32] <Market> May/13/2015 07:52:27 -- Bushels -- $240 -- 1,659 -- SO: No -- Remaining: 7,445 Bushels
[16:13:07] <Market> May/13/2015 08:13:09 -- Bushels -- $240 -- 2,350 -- SO: No -- Remaining: 8,021 Bushels
[16:13:08] <Market> May/13/2015 08:13:09 -- Bushels -- $240 -- 3,750 -- SO: No -- Remaining: 4,271 Bushels
[16:16:07] <Market> May/13/2015 08:16:11 -- Bushels -- $240 -- 200 -- SO: No -- Remaining: 3,675 Bushels
[16:16:08] <Market> May/13/2015 08:16:11 -- Bushels -- $240 -- 196 -- SO: No -- Remaining: 3,479 Bushels
[16:16:08] <Market> May/13/2015 08:16:12 -- Bushels -- $240 -- 312 -- SO: No -- Remaining: 3,167 Bushels
[16:16:09] <Market> May/13/2015 08:16:12 -- Bushels -- $240 -- 324 -- SO: No -- Remaining: 2,843 Bushels
[16:16:10] <Market> May/13/2015 08:16:13 -- Bushels -- $240 -- 270 -- SO: No -- Remaining: 2,573 Bushels
[16:24:12] <Market> May/13/2015 08:24:17 -- Bushels -- $240 -- 312 -- SO: No -- Remaining: 1,032 Bushels
[16:24:14] <Market> May/13/2015 08:24:18 -- Bushels -- $240 -- 329 -- SO: No -- Remaining: 703 Bushels
[16:24:14] <Market> May/13/2015 08:24:18 -- Bushels -- $240 -- 408 -- SO: No -- Remaining: 295 Bushels
[16:24:15] <Market> May/13/2015 08:24:18 -- Bushels -- $240 -- 576 -- SO: No -- Remaining: 0 Bushels
[16:24:16] <Market> May/13/2015 08:24:18 -- Bushels -- $240 -- 747 -- SO: No -- Remaining: 0 Bushels
[16:24:17] <Market> May/13/2015 08:24:18 -- Bushels -- $240 -- 597 -- SO: No -- Remaining: 0 Bushels


[16:24:18] <Market> May/13/2015 08:24:19 -- Bushels -- $320 -- 858 -- SO: No -- Remaining: 0 Bushels
[16:24:19] <Market> May/13/2015 08:24:19 -- Bushels -- $320 -- 955 -- SO: No -- Remaining: 0 Bushels
[16:24:20] <Market> May/13/2015 08:24:19 -- Bushels -- $320 -- 852 -- SO: No -- Remaining: 0 Bushels
[16:24:21] <Market> May/13/2015 08:24:19 -- Bushels -- $320 -- 992 -- SO: No -- Remaining: 0 Bushels
[16:24:23] <Market> May/13/2015 08:24:19 -- Bushels -- $320 -- 789 -- SO: No -- Remaining: 0 Bushels
[16:24:25] <Market> May/13/2015 08:24:20 -- Bushels -- $320 -- 873 -- SO: No -- Remaining: 0 Bushels
[16:24:28] <Market> May/13/2015 08:24:20 -- Bushels -- $320 -- 49 -- SO: No -- Remaining: 0 Bushels



and so on...

don't sos and autobuys kick in at the same time?

To put into perspective of what $300 food gives on 2k land 0 tech:

2000×5.3×300 = 3.18 mil a turn.

<Market>: May/13/2015 15:32:51 -- Bushels -- $219 -- 44,884 -- Asking: $65 -- Trend: DOWN (was $222)
<Market>: May/13/2015 15:34:40 -- Bushels -- $219 -- 1,263 -- SO: No -- Remaining: 43,621 Bushels
<Market>: May/13/2015 15:34:40 -- Bushels -- $219 -- 1,242 -- SO: No -- Remaining: 42,379 Bushels
<Market>: May/13/2015 15:34:40 -- Bushels -- $219 -- 2,989 -- SO: No -- Remaining: 39,390 Bushels
<Market>: May/13/2015 15:34:40 -- Bushels -- $219 -- 2,295 -- SO: No -- Remaining: 7,798 Bushels
<Market>: May/13/2015 15:34:41 -- Bushels -- $219 -- 2,365 -- SO: No -- Remaining: 5,433 Bushels
<Market>: May/13/2015 15:34:41 -- Bushels -- $219 -- 3,367 -- SO: No -- Remaining: 2,066 Bushels
<Market>: May/13/2015 15:34:41 -- Bushels -- $219 -- 3,936 -- SO: No -- Remaining: 0 Bushels
<Market>: May/13/2015 15:34:41 -- Bushels -- $219 -- 3,892 -- SO: No -- Remaining: 0 Bushels
<Market>: May/13/2015 15:34:41 -- Bushels -- $219 -- 5,238 -- SO: No -- Remaining: 0 Bushels
<Market>: May/13/2015 15:34:41 -- Bushels -- $219 -- 8,204 -- SO: No -- Remaining: 0 Bushels
<Market>: May/13/2015 15:34:42 -- Bushels -- $219 -- 10,093 -- SO: No -- Remaining: 0 Bushels
<Market>: May/13/2015 15:34:42 -- Bushels -- $222 -- 13,020 -- SO: No -- Remaining: 0 Bushels
<Market>: May/13/2015 15:34:42 -- Bushels -- $222 -- 13,926 -- SO: No -- Remaining: 0 Bushels
<Market>: May/13/2015 15:34:47 -- Bushels -- $222 -- 31,742 -- Asking: $65 -- Trend: UP (was $219)


(just noticed this (or similar) data has already been posted.)


wow!

May 13, 08:00 May 13, 12:00 $50 $320 $201.52 138,938
May 13, 12:00 May 13, 16:00 $42 $320 $198.53 463,345

138938 + 463345 = 602283 bushels * $198.53 = $119 mil = apx 531k net. (which can be made by turn #99.)

Lol another exploit.

Didnt qzjul cap how much a bot is willing to pay or only for tech?

Only tech. Everything else is compared to private market prices. And if I remember correctly., that's $360.

The bug exists with turrets/jets/troops/tanks as well. A bot will pay up to $209 for turrets.

hm, that's how the market functions normally though; if there's nothing below price X and price X is lower than PM price Y, you pay price X, right?

No - you wait for cheaper food! They are probably losing money taking turns if they are buying food that expensive.

Yup- that's the major advantage a human player has over BOT. They know when to wait out market., and know what's reasonable price or not.

TBH,. I don't even understand why private market price for bushels are at 360s... Oil I can understand at 400. Shouldn't bushels be like 200 tops?

sells at:
oil 60 PM
bushel 29 PM

buys at:
oil 400 PM
bushel 360 PM

Has anyone here ever bought food off PM before? I've bought oil, but nvr food at that cost.

'cause Earth:2025

i c.

i know i critique a lot, qzjul. but i'm really greatful that you talk to your player base. there are many gaming sites that simply don't care.

:-)

Yea, we could have a discussion about changing that price. But, honestly, I *LIKE* the fact that the bushels market can be wide open. Makes for more variation. Makes me want to raise the PM prices of the other goods sometimes lol...

there really should not be an upper tier on prices, it is up to the server to decide what this is... for instance there have been times when destocking too late, and having bought out the PM I am looking at $300 turrets and $240 troops. The choice then becomes do I spend the last billion on these or refuse to pay the price, I tend to buy and say oh well, just made someone happy ;)

People stock bushels in the 360 range figuring no one is going to buy them, a rep casher with full turns, may very well nibble on it to play a handful of turns, vs. losing the turns. I have seen those conditions in the past, I do not know if express ever runs out of food but it would be an interesting scenario.

At no point will you be spending $360 on food. It just isn't going to happen.

$360 * 20000 (food consumed) = 7.2 mil a turn (not even including military costs). Not on EXPRESS anyways.

And if you're stocking, I'm not sure why you'd be out of food.

Food is getting expensive now?

[ Irrelevant ]

[ Irrelevant ]

Only because more food is being bought:

Last set:
May 7, 23:00 May 8, 00:00 $33 $38 $36.96 2,811,412
May 8, 00:00 May 8, 01:00 $34 $39 $37.00 2,897,124
May 8, 01:00 May 8, 02:00 $34 $37 $34.49 8,643,146
May 8, 02:00 May 8, 03:00 $35 $39 $37.64 2,292,607
May 8, 03:00 May 8, 04:00 $35 $42 $38.27 5,868,744
May 8, 04:00 May 8, 05:00 $37 $42 $39.38 2,002,704
May 8, 05:00 May 8, 06:00 $35 $39 $36.45 4,549,920
May 8, 06:00 May 8, 07:00 $29 $35 $32.62 2,733,134
May 8, 07:00 May 8, 08:00 $37 $38 $37.93 2,437,654
May 8, 08:00 May 8, 09:00 $35 $38 $36.52 3,062,977
May 8, 09:00 May 8, 10:00 $37 $38 $37.42 3,480,158
May 8, 10:00 May 8, 11:00 $38 $40 $38.77 5,187,443

This set:
May 13, 04:00 May 13, 08:00 $120 $240 $164.74 49,303
May 13, 08:00 May 13, 12:00 $50 $320 $201.52 138,938
May 13, 12:00 May 13, 16:00 $42 $320 $198.53 463,345
May 13, 16:00 May 13, 20:00 $29 $247 $108.51 821,821
May 13, 20:00 May 14, 00:00 $37 $188 $73.20 2,551,490
May 14, 00:00 May 14, 04:00 $34 $40 $37.42 2,172,572
May 14, 04:00 May 14, 08:00 $22 $35 $33.57 2,910,783
May 14, 08:00 May 14, 12:00 $29 $35 $32.60 4,389,861
May 14, 12:00 May 14, 16:00 $23 $37 $34.14 10,530,617
May 14, 16:00 May 14, 20:00 $29 $47 $34.15 11,706,153
May 14, 20:00 May 15, 00:00 $35 $88 $45.07 7,740,486
May 15, 00:00 May 15, 04:00 $35 $76 $40.37 10,809,725
May 15, 04:00 May 15, 08:00 $40 $76 $50.32 8,671,774

As you can see. There's more than 3x the food bought.