"Warfare is the primary method of achieving greatness and attaining recognition among your opponents." Earth Empires Creators

Express has currently lost this fundamental core value of its reason for existence.

Success is measured in net worth alone, without regard for how the net worth was attained. Players can and do "win" without ever engaging in a single act of war. Players routinely "win" with their only act of warfare being attacks on countries which are paralyzed by their own incompetence.
Players make the top ten preying on bots and noobs. Warriors are derided as "suiciders" and cashers praised as "champions". Mr Ford describes Express as a "netter's server". In other words, greatness is measured by netting not by warfare.

This decadent state of affairs is not how Express was intended.

The current rule set is slanted heavily, mightily, abusively toward netting without opportunity for what the game's creators said was to be the primary method of attaining greatness. The PRIMARY method.

A history of how this masterful war game devolved into digital monopoly is beyond the scope of this post.

Suffice it to say that rampant cheating and random acts of violence combined to spur the creation of a stiflingly secure GDI. Any suggestion that GDI be changed is met with horrified expressions of "oh, I might be killed randomly!" and accusations of wanting to "suicide" against more successful players. However, GDI evolved because of the cheating and the randomness of war. The current GDI rule set is the result of reasoned decisions by people who love the game. Those people based on their experience rightly believed that creating security for the netters was worth sacrificing creativity among the warrior class. Therefor, I have come to believe that attempts to change GDI may be misguided.
GDI should not be changed.

the Temple rightly states that there is no possible disadvantage to joining GDI. As I have considered this wise man's simple truth, the cure to what ails our beloved game became clear. We can not change the security blanket that is GDI but we can and must empower those who dare the risk of not joining the numbing collective. If one is willing to engage in full blown Express as it was intended with its threat of random violence and instant annihilation, with the dread one feels when turning on their computer after being gone for four hours wondering what villainy has befallen their country, there should be some reward for running that risk. Risk taking deserves reward. That is a fundamental rule of life, economics and gaming. It is a self evident truth that does not brook contention.

The issue then arises as to the nature and extent of the reward for daring the fearsome risk of not joining GDI.
I suggest the following upon clicking a button that reads "I choose not to join GDI"

1) 5 extra turns per hour awarded on the hour
2) 3 free government changes without revolution

Some netters may well choose not to join GDI in return for the extra turns and opportunities created by government changes but I think most will continue to opt for the safety of GDI where they need not bear the cost of troops, tanks and missile defense. Warriors, risk takers and hard core gamers will assume the awful risk of individual vulnerability in exchange for enhanced opportunity.

These changes can help us ensure that our creators' vision that "warfare is the primary method of achieving greatness" is preserved.



"Warfare is the primary method of attaining greatness" Earth Empires Creators

'the Temple rightly states that there is no possible disadvantage to joining GDI.'

I do not know if he really said this, but there are numerous disadvantages to joining GDI.

I wouldn't consider a warrior someone who blindsides multiple countries for 4-5 consecutive hits. That would be called an idiot, who is then later killed by one of the countries in which he acted foolish upon. Most of the players on this server do not appreciate nor tolerate land pigs (multiple hits).

I'll have to read the rest after I have taken my meds.

"Welcome to Earth Empires!
Earth Empires is a free browser based strategy game where you take control of your nation's military and economy. Command your country's military to attaIk and defend against your enemies. Execute attack strategies to relieve opponents of their resources and land. Strategically invest in technology to outpace the economies of other countries. Ally with your friends or make new friendships by joining a clan. Conduct military operations, govern your country and build your empire.

Continuing the legacy of Earth:2025 - one of the first massive multiplayer browser games - Earth Empires brings a fresh new spin to a classic style of gaming.

Create an account and start playing now! "

This is from the home page....

I don't see anything equating to your meaning of what Earth Empires should be based on a first time meeting. I gather from the welcome page that your goal is to be the best, attain the most land and be the strongest country(networth). Thus the in game rating system based on networth.... I see nothing about fighting to attain greatness....

Attaining victory with warfare, how can this be attained. I see only 1 real solution. To have a victor you need an opponent. If you feel the need to flex your warring skills in the server to feel glourious..... Come to the forums and challenge someone.....

I really have trouble grasping your hard on towards GDI.... It's not worth all this effort your putting in. All I see from your posts are notions to make some advantage not to be in GDI or hurt GDI members...
due to possible inability to hack it against those who do join and follow GDI limitations....

If you want your glourious express battle call someone out, don't opt to have rules or game functions changed so you can start fluff with some random dude who can out play you....

My quote is directly from the war room help page. Go to war room, click on help.
It is an exact quote from the creators of the game.

The first two sentences of the quote xninja pulled up is all about attack and defend. Nothing about join a collective where no one can seriously damage your country and see if you can raise more money than anyone else. "Execute attack strategies", "command your country's military to attack", that is what is missing from the current rule set. Note that even in the quote xninja selected outpacing other economies is ranked fourth not first. The quote is essentially attack, defend, attack, net. Not our current net, net, net, defend.

drkprinc's argument against the current DR rules is yet another example of the rules being twisted to avoid warring but that is his point not mine. Netters benefit from the outrageously long DR because they only get hit twice or three times in 24 hours instead of the six or eight times they would get hit with more reasonable rules.

I do not subscribe to the theory that net worth alone should determine the winner but that is a whole other issue. I have some distant memory of the mods and the G.O.A.T. discussing another formula but again that is another issue.
If these changes are implemented, the net worth of non GDI countries will become competitive.

I truly believe that my only motivation is to restore some of the excitement the game lost when it had to savagely contort GDI to stop the cheating. Remember that the current rule set is the product of people changing the rules. These rules are not set in stone.

Why am I so persistent? Because we have seen changes implemented because of suggestions to the forum; additions to the powers of the dictatorship, changes to bomb banks and raid food stores and the current rule against stealing tech from GDI countries spring immediately to mind but there are countless other examples.

I have no interest in hurting GDI members, none. I consider them the Junior Varsity. If they want to play Farmville, that is fine by me. Who wants to hurt the little guys, not me.

Note of course that Express GDI actually exponentially increases bottom feeding. The news is filled with one top nation after another hitting small countries and I am as guilty of that as anyone but it is a function of the GDI restriction against double tapping. I can not risk hitting 35 twice so I will hit 35, then 36 and then 46. The guy below me hits 46 and then 55. Do you really think #46 cares whether he got double tapped or two different big guys hit him?

Xninja's statement that I am trying to make some advantage out of not being in GDI is exactly right.

My motivation is that the current GDI rules have placed a straight jacket on the entire server. GDI was never meant to replace warring with netting but that is what has occurred. I believe that by restoring some of the original balance we can break that straight jacket. Tourney does not have these GDI rules. I am no longer trying to change GDI, as I mentioned they are the necessary painful remnant of years of cheating. But I believe that having gotten the cheating under control we can now move to restore the original intent of the creators. I am not looking for individual combat in Express. I want the game to be a fun clash of armies struggling for supremacy not a business school test of netting strategies where warfare has been marginalized.
Simple as that.

@Clintonista

There's benefits for playing non-gdi and there's benefits to playing with GDI. Both have pros & cons.

The way GDI works on EXPRESS is primarily to prevent suiciding. There's almost no argument that can possibly outweigh the benefits of preventing suiciding on EXPRESS. And that's why GDI on EXPRESS will likely never change.

In response to your bottom-feeding statement, it's part of the game. You lose minimal loses to being bottom-fed., but the player bottom-feeding you, risks the chance that you mid-feed, top-feed him/her later in the set for significantly more land.

stop begging to be able to suicide people.

I agree what it has become, but I differ:

Get rid of GDI, altogether.

Will bring more activity to the market, and lower (more competitive) NW's.

That makes more sense. The war room is only 1 part of the game. The statement holds true in that regard.



Attacking and defending is very much a part of this game. Even under GDI protection you are subject to attacks. Attacking for land is one of the biggest parts of this game. As is making retals, ROR's, double taps and triple taps. GDI protects no one from this.



I AM fairly sure DR abuse is subject to deletion. GDI plays no role in DR abuse.



The game has a ranking system for a reason. If you can't understand that logic and can continue to assume other means of winning the round, your just a fool....

Even with the current "rules" the server is still very competitive, regardless if you can see it or not.



That is true. They are not set in stone.... But why fix whats not broken.




..... Junior Varsity that repeatable out play Varsity?



This happens every server, GDI or not...



GDI was changed to keep people who dont play like fluffs protected by those who do. Like I said about your need to war. Challenge someone, don't resort to being a coward and complain about GDI.... The war element of this game is still here, you can't just screw someone over for making 1 land grab on your less powerful nation.....

And lastly.... You should do some homework on the creators :-P, they are so pro netting I'm shocked there are still ways to kill a country....B-)

celphi

I said do no change GDI
I do not want GDI changed
it stops the cheating, fantastic
and of course being bottom fed hardly hurts at all, that is why cashers lurk in the fifties and take minor damage so they can dash to the finish. With the long DR, netting is again preferred over warring.

Just to be crystal clear, this proposal has nothing to do with changing GDI, absolutely nothing.



simply give non GDI
-5 turns per hour
-3 government changes with no revolution



Makes the game more exciting, more challenging and makes the decision to join GDI a strategic choice where one has to weigh security against the opportunity cost, rather then a no-brainer.

Xninja
GDI and DR abuse are totally separate issues, absolutely.
drkprinc's comments have nothing to do with abuse only with how absurdly long DR lasts.
DR should equal PS not 12x PS. DR=12x(PS) is a target's dream and impedes the creators' stated intent.
It is an artifact of the Primary server rules and not at all appropriate to Express.

I am not sure where the allegation of cowardice comes in. Advocating change on these forums is hardly the act of a coward. The name calling and wild accusations that ensue are generally quite caustic.
As to your point about the creators, I can only go by their words describing their creation. They describe a war game not a monopoly knock off.

Gdi to protect against suicidiers isnt going anywhere but at least you now acknowledge this fact.

Currently the only advantage a non gdi player has that im aware is 10% increased gains on grabs.

Im on board with giving some incentive to play without gdi but your current proposal of turns and government changes(especially government is too extreme).

Not only do non-GDI get 10% gains (which is a multiplier to the other bonuses)., but you could get insane LGs against GDI players in final six hrs without fear of retaliation.


There's also the ability to demo bots, to make multiple PS possible. Or BOMB BANKS - BURN BUSHELS (both which steal) against GDI players with no consequences during final six hrs.

There's others., but those are a few.

5 turns per hour? FYI we are getting 20 turns / hr now.

The satisfaction from this game for me is to be able to farm people to the top and net. Not to click 'Attack Again' button 200 times to kill someone off based on 'just because this is war game I have to kill'

5 turns per hour? FYI we are getting 20 turns / hr now.

The satisfaction from this game for me is to be able to farm people to the top and net. Not to click 'Attack Again' button 200 times to kill someone off based on 'just because this is war game I have to kill'

l4zybone

thank you for your support. "No GDI" or even "tourney style GDI" can not work on a server where players collaborate(cheat) and randomly pick out players to group kill. We have years of negative experience with that.

Celphi
look at the results from the last ten resets. Non GDI players have never competed. The imbalance is so bad now that
almost everyone in the server joins GDI, the few who do not are random killers. This has gone on for so long that people, like h20rich, assume that if you do not wish to join GDI you must be a random killer. I fed the data from the last ten sets to Siri and asked her the odds of a non GDI player winning the next reset she responded 172,806.2 to 1 against.

172,806.2 to 1

Arguing that the abilities of GDI and non GDI countries are comparable is absurd.

MountainYeti
Thanks for your support for the concept if not the exact details of the fix.

h20rich
You and I are in total agreement.
Your satisfaction is exactly the satisfaction which this game should provide. Exactly.
I agree with you that I see no point in random killing just because it is a war game.
I do not advocate that all. Just because most of the players who now choose to forgo GDI are these random evil doers does not mean it was always so or that it must always be that way.

My suggestion is not made to empower these madmen. I seek to restore the brilliant military complexity of the game.
The satisfaction of warring to the top is enhanced when the warring is more complex and challenging. The game can be more than just farming, it can be challenging.

To illustrate my meaning let us look at a target from the point of view of a GDI attacker and a non GDI assailant:

Target Country:
200 turns
200,000 troops
1,000,000 turrets
300,000 tanks
4 CM 3 Nukes
no country multiplier, no weapons tech, no bonus

Our GDI attacker sees a nice plump target and hits it one time and one time only. The country can not retal, ever.
Our GDI attacker farms this target.

Our non GDI assailant sees a target which has the capability to retal in a multitude of very painful ways and has to assess the likelihood of a response to even a single tap. Our non GDI assailant might pass on this target.

GDI is not just a shield against suiciders it is also a sword against this type of target.

The non GDI game is more challenging, more complex and more fun. Warring, not farming, where not every country is a helpless cripple incapable of response is how the game was designed.

All I want to do is give gamers an alternative to the simple see a target, hit it, move on assembly line. Bring back the original complexities built into the game. The reason the suggested fix is so large is because the gulf between a GDI country and a non GDI is enormous.

The satisfaction of winning in that environment is enhanced not diminished.

That's not really a true to life example is it. The chances are that country is in GDI so it can't retal in multiple ways. If it's not GDI then it's fishing for a war anyway. Or it's fluff and deserves to be farmed.

I often get hit early looking something like that. Try it, and see if I'm a cripple incapable of response.

i could easily finish t10 as non-GDI. I just don't have the time to monitor my country in mIRC.

go join alliance server, you can war gain there andget #1

erm... cool story bro?

tldr.............. something about gdi............... gdi bad.

Listening to h2o talk about suiciders/cheaters is hilarious.

here here

With Theocracy the free GDI from Bonuses is so nice, but I imagine that's why most join it, because its free....