if i hadnt stalked them

they wouldnt have been caught on this server

and people would think they cheated on only two servers

dictators with diminished spy capbilities
will never win the nw title

never

at swirve i routinely ran dictatorships but never saw one win

the spy strength on this site is as u know dramatically less

impossible to overcome

will facebook really accept a game server that has rampant cheating and no discipline?

i doubt it very seriously, i am sorry i just cant see them jeopardizing a multimillion dollar site with a cheat filled game

as soon as facebook does their due diligence they will drop this project faster than LaE tears up the rule book.

I agree let the admins handle the last instance.
If its over its over, but we know the next one is coming.

The best deterrent and the only way to expand is to have clear standards going in and sunlight on the process.

Otherwise u get situations like David Stern picking champions.

Twain is right about some things.

We dont need a hypothetical pro football example.

The 1950s Cleveland Browns were the greatest pro football team of all time and they destroyed the all america conference which had to merge into the nfl. The browns chased the nfl champion rams out of cleveland to los angeles. N one watched the nfl team despite their championship because the browns were so much more talented than the nfl champs. The Browns did go to ten consecutive championships and it was bad for football.
The reason the Browns became the greatest team of all time was that they were able to recruit all of the best players. The nfl teams had a draft and restricted recruiting while the browns league did not and the browns had an endless bankroll. That is why none of the nfl teams could compete against Paul Brown. It wasnt until after the Browns were restricted by draft rules for nearly a decade that the dynasty collapsed. We should learn this lesson.

If clan A cheats again and again. like USC, you have to keep restricting them. If Clan A's leader cheats the penalty is greater than if it was merely some members. Twain makes a great point about punishing a clan while the cheater just skates off to another clan. But will Clan B accept the player, knowing that they risk their recruiting if the player cheats again which he almost certainly will.

Twain indicates that Earth should not be interested in parity.
I think that is debatable. If we really have any interest in expansion, or the FaceBook rumors or anything like that then some measures to acheive parity are probably a good thing.

It was not until title 9 caused the other teams to be able to catch up to the big ten, that college football really took off.

As to Rahl's point that small clans cheat also, that is why the restriction should be on percentage of size at the time of cheating.

Rahl says that cheating is caused by lack of skill, Does anyone think that the latest example of cheating was done by players who lack skill? In the most recent example the cheating was by a very skilled leader of the largest of all clans. Look at USC they cheat despite the fact that they could win the pac 10 easily without any need to cheat at all.
Cheaters do not stop cheating once they move into first place.

Yes.

According to the NCAA, when a team recruits too well you take away their right to recruit. Cllassic examples are SMU, USC and Bama. SMU had the two greatest recruiting classes of all ime; they got the death penalty. USC has a fifty year tradition of illegal recruiting; they have ruined their conference becasue the conference will not discipline them. Bama was allowed to win the BS championship despite being on probation for cheating.

We should adopt the NCAA model of restricting recruiting for organizations which are caught cheating.

The size and duration of the restriction would be based on the severity of the cheating just like in the NCAA.

A hypothetical clan which has been caught cheating and does not deserve the death penalty,

the first reset after the violation

restricted to 80% of their size at the time of the violation

second reset if no new violations

85% of size at the time of the violation

This is not punitive merely remedial.

sorry too busy following the LaE cheating scandal to do this this set

please see a more complete post on ffa.

Recidivism by cheaters is high. This game has always been plagued by cheaters. Implement plans now to contain the next scandal that we know with certainty is coming.

Please see my more complete post on the ffa server.

The mods have detected the cheating and handed out the punishment. Fine that concludes this scandal.

We should plan now for the next cheaing scandal.

The recidivsm rate for puter hackers is very high. Swirve closed in part because guys like these were cheating and yet they pick it right up again at the first opportunity. They know that cheating jeopardizes the entire game yet they do it anyway. They do it on multiple servers ruining not just ffa but others as well. Obviously nothing can be done to deter them. We know another cheating scandal is coming. So plan now for when you catch LaE again be it three months from now or a year from now. You can not stop them but perhaps you can contain them.

In order to contain the damage they will do, there are several actions that can be taken based on how MLB contained the steroid scandal, the NCAA tries to restrain recruiting violaions and the NBA handled its cheating referee scandal. These are not punitive actions merely reasonable steps which can be taken to contain recidivsm and the harm they can cause before they are detected next time.

Obviously these four guys can never again be allowed to play in the same clan or on the same individual server.

Ckearly a clan can never again be allowed to become so big that even honest managers can not detect cheating within their ranks.
I have no idea how big is too big but there are men on this server who can devise the appropriate safeguards.
Clans must be required to take mesures to ensure that their players are not employing clan tactics on the individual servers.

The community should have an open discussion about how to implement these safeguards. The community must also create a place for whistleblowers to get reports of suspected cheating before respected fact finders. In addition when a complaint of a suspected illegal ingame message is filed, the complainant should have a way of keeping the ingame message. We must protect the identity of the accused during the process but the complaint must be reviewed by fact finders that everyone trusts. If these fixes are undertaken now the next scandal will be much less damaging and more easily contained.

I came to this site after swirve closed, my very first foray into Express I stumbled across the shadow block of express cheaters, when after i attacked someone they started ingame emailing me and asking me if iwas m317 or some code name like that. I told them I was. They then called me names for attacking a fellow clansman and threatened me with sanctions if i did it again. Later that same set i started committing espionage and a whole bunch of guys emailed me telling me i was jeopardizing my standing in the clan. I sent some of those emails to the mods and began what turned out to be a several month battle against a group of persistent cheaters. I joined ffa and alliance for the sole purpose of having an understanding of who in this shadow block of cheaters I was dealing with. At that point I had never heard of LaE. I did not join a clan because it would be unfair of me to join a clan and then do nothing but study LaE. If i joined a clan they would naturally expect me to participate for the betterment of that clan and since my sole interest in being in those servers is to better understand the shadow Express LaE i just felt it was not moral to join a clan and then fail to perform for them. I started a one man war with LaE under the name a05 to see who was int the clan and how they would react. They killed me 134 times.
I kept playing Express gathering an understanding of how LaE manipulated the server so that their players win. I began attacking them constantly but was not yet on any forum, frankly did not know forum even existed. But i spent tons of time studying express watching their patterns and began o be able to predict their market actions and end of set tacics.
Tinysub noticed that i was killing LaE and just getting crushed by their enforcers on the ffa. He recruited me to join SYN. I was hesitant because i did not wan to get addicted to the game and because i knew nothing about clans. I decided to join one and see what it was like. I would see if they all cheated frankly expecting that perhaps LaE's conduct was the norm. Zues is an extremely ethical person who is a credit to this game. He repeatedly asked me not to attack LaE but I must fight evil where I find it, sorry that is how I was raised. He and I have not spoken in weeks but he never asked me to cheat or do any of things so prevalent in LaE. In fact we got tangled up in the team server and he and tinysub killed me, so there you go. Zues introduced me to boxcar and eestats and those ools have proved invaluable in my understanding of the web that is LaE. I have not played my ffa countries except sporadically for many days. When I do i just attack LaE.
My current country in alliance is for the same purpose of understanding the patterns in LaE and is barely out of protection. I know LaE will kill it as soon as i announce. However since the LaE flack seems to have convinced reasonable people that somehow i am on trial not them and i should tell the name i will, it is a05. LaFamiglia has been farming me like mad and i have repeaedly asked them to stop because all i want to do is spy on LaE, check with them and they can verify that.
I also have a country in primary again the sole purpose is to try to find similarities between the shadow Express LaE and any potential shadow LaE block in primary, the same is true with tourney. These countries have helped me identify patterns in the block names which i use to track the shadow LaE in Express.
Part of me loves the fact that LaE has been exposed but I am concerned that if they stop playing the shadow block on express i will find this game far less interesting than it has been these past many weeks. Watching them manipulate markets and pick the winners of the Express NW has been fun and i will miss it if they stop. However cheaters have to cheat, hackers have to hack and i am confident they will be back and i can once again spy on their nefarious activities.

I dont respond directly to convicted cheaters

so to those reading this

does anyone really think that a guy who runs 14 land farms in ffa to finish in the top ten and bring reknown to LaE and who routinely acts as the LaE enforcer on this server and who presumably has access to boxcar had no idea his clan was cheating?

across multiple servers

across multiple sets

NOW3P says ok ok we cheated at ffa and yeah i run 14 land farms and yes we cheated at alliance and yes we had ten countries deleted off of this server, consider that,
ten countries deleted off of this server and we had countries deleted off of tournamentand we did send Gregg ingame messages but we did not cheat this server

NO REASONABLE PERSON CAN BELIEVE THIS GUY

i have my facts straight

please read the announcement

LaE cheats
systematically
brazenly
everywhere

Please pay particular attention to the area about in game chats where LaE coordinated activities

I take that as possibly a reference to the numerous ingame LaE messages i received when they thought i was one of theirs
i forwarded those to the moderators


I admit it is very pleasing to be totally vindicated

Make sure you read the LaE announcement from the administrators

quote LaE cheated across multiple servers and multiple resets unquote

I will take that apology now

It is too bad they did not man up before this public announcement

How can we ever trust these guys??

so LaE is too big to give the death penalty

i understand

is it reasonable to expect hackers and cheaters not to hack and cheat?

three countries deleted in the last few days

hmmm

only three LaE cheaters signed up for this set on this server and got deleted?

a little surprising i would have expected mor LaE cheaters

puter gamers will always cheat

puter gamers were raised on cheats, they paid for them, studied them and even stole them

asking a gamer not to cheat is like asking a mosquito not to suck

BIRDS GOTTA FLY

we need to learn to live with it

have u ever seen a dictatorship win a set?

can u imagine a dictatorship winning with the current rules regarding emasculated spies?

no i do not think that having stripped the dictatorship of spies that a massive military advantage is extreme

even with that big an davantage it would be extremely tough to win a set with I

i only play one country

i know u LaE guys will need a minute to absorb this

i only play one country
no multis for me, no land farms, no slave allies
if i got deleted ten countries would not drop off this server
i dont play 7% of the active countires in this server myself

i am one of these anachronistic guys who think that cheating even at a puter game is immoral

i know u guys r saying lighten up, immoral?

the LaE position is clear
cheating is now and always will be part of this game
u can not get a bunch of puter gamers together and not expect some of them to cheat
for many puter gamers the thrill is in the cheat
the game itself is secondary to the hack, the cheat the bad boy rush of breaking the rules
businesses sell cheats to all puter games
twenty somethings have been using cheats at puter games their whole lives

so when somebody says that cheating is inappropriate
they clearly have no idea what the person is talking about
its a head scratcher

cheating at puter games is a multi million dollar industry
cheating at puter games is expected condoned and not the least bit immoral
LaE has built its clan on this philosophy
you dont get too big to fail by being overly honest
LaE has spread that philosophy to all the servers
first deleted off ffa, then deleted off alliance and now express

innocent bystanders like kemo raised on cheating at puter games honestly can not understand why i care or even how it is any of my business that LaE cheats

If u can not grasp why cheating is bad
or why everyone should oppose it
then this is not the forum for the philosophical explanation
this forum routinely degenerates into ADD grunts and insults

so suffice it to say i understand why LaE has cheated and will continue to joyfully openly brazenly cheat in the future

I am thrilled that our game has administrators who understand that cheating is bad for the game and have acted with courage to stop the miscreants

I fear that LaE will continue to cheat because it is their innate character but for now they have been slowed

LaE and even Kemo seem to think my objection is outcome based, that is they think i object because it makes it harder for me to win
that assumption is in error

i just have this anachronistic aversion to lying and cheating

so go ahead LaE insult my mother now

how would we resolve the situation where an LaE player accidentally got paired against his own multi?

LaE caught red handed admits nothing

no surprise there

NOW3P revokes his offer to each me the LaE way to play

Well, if i wanted to run some multis or 29 landfarms, i would not need instruction on how to get away with it.

ur goal next set should be to try to kill as many Liars@E as are deleted by moderators

my guess is that the moderators will kill far more than u will

conservatively figure only 45% of the liarsatearth are multis
figure the moderators catch 10% not 14% like this set
that means u would have to kill 42.7 countries just to keep even with the moderators

unless u adopt their tactics and run 100 countries
i dont see how u can do it
no offense tex but it seems insurmountable

oh and Jiff

a legal premise holds that silence when confronted with wrongdoing can be evidence of duplicity

if those guys were innocent they would be in here condemning Liars@E and proclaiming their innocence

they are not here, ergo they are not innocent dupes

In the last day,
ten countries were deleted from the express server

were they deleted because they were part of the evil Liars@Earth clan?

i read one of the Liars@E threads on another server
it was mentioned deletes would affect the cheater's countries on other servers because of how our accounts are set up

for example if u delete one of the cheaters at FFA it will delete his country in primary etc

i do not know if it is true but it sounds reasonable

so i ran a check on this set of express to see how many of the Liars@E accounts were deleted in our game

of the original 135 players one australia was killed by combat

ten were either deleted or killed in protection
nine were deleted

their numbers were
1,27,65,69,96,106,119,123,132,134

by reasonable inference there were ten Liars@E cheater accounts in our server this set

it makes me wonder why the number of LiarsaEarth cheaters were down so dramatically from previous sets

if one were to posit that fewer than ten percent of the players in our game in previous resets were Liars@E cheaters, I would not believe it

Now that LaE has been caught red handed cheating on every other server

they should admit that they cheated repeatedly on this one as well

they should apologize to all of us who play this game

they should apologize to me specifically for making me look bad when all i was doing was trying to clean up the game

those of us who play this game should accept their apology and move on

but we must stay vigilant
they may try it again

we are grateful to have this site

the rampant cheating is disturbing though

no one seriously doubts that LaE cheats.

look at the threads they openly brag that there are only fifteen LaE members but they have over 800 countries

they are so open about it it can only mean they are so well conneced they do not fear reprisal

As previoulsy discussed here is a ranking of the best warriors thus far:

1) 9
2) 78
3) 28
4) 23
5) 7

Congratulations

without doing all the calculations it appears that

INDESTRUCTIBLE

is the early leader for the WoR


oprovin is close but he may just have been farming his own multi

there are some active wargainers this reset

where are hobo and the netters defense league?
we certainly expected 39 to have launched a lot more missiles by this time in defense of those who can no or will not defend themselves

u have to do something about dictatorships

either discontinue them or increase their military powers threefold

i hate to be a broken record but

with spies emasculated a 35% stronger betty white just gives us helen thomas

so dictatorships are no longer a fun option to play

and fyi i know two players including the guy who hooked me on this game who played every day for nearly a decade on swirve who dont play anymore because without spies the game is not a challenge
so you may want to rethink your supposition that because spies complicate the game and drive away new players they are bad for the community
i think the more complex the game the more players you will attract

thanks for your consideration

u also have spy issues

because u have turned james bond into betty white
neither side will invest the effort in building spies unless u return them to their former glory

in a head to head game i dont think the argument that spies are unfair to new players and netters and consequently bad for the game will hold any water at all

first guy out of protection loses

unless u ban attacks and make it netters only
an idea i hate
or unless u arrange for simultaneous oop while both players are on line
which i love

here is what i suggest as a testing format

start with two guys who are willing to commit two hours to a single game

give them 1000 turns and and protection lasts five minutes
regardless of turns taken
use the private market so no technical challenge
should be easy
market prices and available goods are initially same as always so building if any occurs normally
but adjust prices one minute before protection ends to prices that more accurately reflect usual market prices
and then fluctuate those prices as u see fit but unrelated to player's sales just use the private market and new pricing

sales by players are instantaneous

if both players survive the first 1000 turns 500 more come on the half hour

once u have beta tesed this enough u can go to more usual time frames but oop can not occur unless both players on line

ok again i will not respond to the blather and fulminations about my personality. I get that some people can not hear this idea simply because of their feelings about the person proposing it. Again i thank NOW3P for his objective criticisms

Let us examine the objective objections to the system;
1) rewards suiciding and farming
2) rewards those who are dedicated to playing the game
3) possibility of abuse
4) too many uploads
5) target uploads

1) I do not want to be accused of attacking netters so i want to phrase this carefully. Netters disparagingly call lgs suiciding and people who view this game as a war game suiciders. This phrase shows the nertters' contempt for predators. In a clan game it may be suicide to hit a netter but in express it is far from suicide. There is a fundamental divide between netters who play this game like it is symcity and predaors who play this game like it is axis and allies.
This award is meant to measure a player's abilities as a predator so of course the prey will hate the very idea. The purpose of the award is to measure the ability to play this game as a war game, so the objection that it rewards warring will not be heard.

2) It rewards those who spend hours playing.
Yes, if you are dedicated to this game you will be rewarded.
If this game is just a sidebar to you running 45 countries in the ffa then you will not win the WoR. NOW3P is right you can win the NW title playing three minutes a day. I submit that this is a strength of the award not a weakness. Those who are dedicated to this server should be rewarded, only a netter could disagree with that. oops excuse me i should not disparage netters but seriously how can one object to rewarding people who put time and effort into the game?
Netting is not time consuming, predation is; netting does not require a great deal of thought about these particular circumstances, predation does. There should be a way to measure and reward that dedication.

3) Abuse is rampant in our game. on every server. On FFA there are countires that have 14 landfarms and grow to over 100000 acres. There is no greater abuse than that. You dont stop playing the game nor devising rule changes just because of the certainty of abuse. My numerous posted objections to abuses show that i am aware of and resentful about the abuses both real and imagined on the Express server. Can this be abused? certainly but with evolution we can stem the abuses.

4) If a player is voaracious enough to launch 200 lgs, he will not be dissuaded by having to click upload after every attack.

5) Spy op uploads are a routine part of clan play on boxcar. Target country information will be readily available. If the attacker is just attacking blindly in the dark with no spy op then he is not a very good predator.

While I thank NOW3P for his criticisms of the concept, he has only convinced me of the necessity for this award. We need an award that recognizes effort and skill not just those who play for three minutes a day and win the NW title.

just an observation from a player whose favorite server is express

I understand that your rules are primarily for clan games and express is a tiny fraction of the community so this objection does not impact most players

Express currently has the exact amount of turns which strongly favor H countries anyway

H countries routinely win and dominate the top ten in Express

it being self-evident that the natural progression of NW in this game favors Indycoms at first then the theocracies with the republics and finally the democracies finishing best

so in Express strengthening the H platform will just put that server in more of an imbalance than it already is

thx for considering these comments

i agree with you mr cobalt

any suggestions in this regard will be appreciated

ok since this is an evolutionary process; lets skip the military grade for this reset and reevaluate next week

since the express server resets every week it is a great beta testing ground

this reset we just go strictly off the formula with no military grade

since eestats has everyhing we need i or some other volunteers should be able to post the winner by tuesday afternoon

thx for making eestats available to the community

for the next reset should we see if we can recruit some respected volunteers to look at boxcar downloads and vote for the WoR?

kemo and trippsters comments do not warrant any response

NOW3P

THANK YOU FOR YOUR CONSTRUCTIVE COMMENTS
THANK YOU FOR SAYING THERE MAY BE SOMETHING HERE

I agree that I am neither qualified to be the sole arbiter of who wins nor am I the best advocate of any proposed additions to scoring strategies. If the scoring is not objective it is worthless. If a committee would form to consider this I would be very happy, even if I were not on the commitee. NW would still be measured and netters could still use it as their standard of excellence. The WoR would be for players who use attack stratgies.

I will not address your demeaning comments because there is no point in disputing them. Let us just keep this positive.

You indicate that finding out how much a strike obtains in terms of food money and research makes this a no go. Surely that issue can be finessed. If a player wants to compete for the WoR he could send his victory screen to eestats or boxcar or some other site to be graded. On that screen all those stats will be available.

Will this encourage farming? it may especially farming one's landfarm like 6 and 114 last set where the landfarm is hit seven or eight times with no real retal. But even without this measurement 6 landfarmed 114 all the way to the top. In addition some countries will just hit their friends on the last day but again that happens now. The military grade would have to consider whether the attacker is just hitting his own multi or a fellow clansman. Is it complicated? yes

is it insoluble? no

WILL this server benefit from the evolution of an objective means to measure success of attack strategies in addition to the NW that measures netting?

Clearly yes

it is time for those of us who play this server as an individual war game to invent a more accurate objective measure of the quality of a country's strategy and the execution of its strategy.

This measure should be called the WoR, Warrior of the Reset

Surely. others have tried and failed to invent such a measure but their failure should not deter us from the effort.

First we should endeavor to determine what factors must be considered in measuring the quality of a country's play.
I would suggest we assess the quality and quantity of the nation's land grabs including factors such as money food and research obtained in the strike. We should assess whether the hit was taken on a country that was likely to retal. Ideally we would measure the nation's use of spies but given the administrators' recent statements that spies are unfair and bad for he game perhaps we should not measure their utility. Since I believe that spies are a fun and important part of the game I would include their use. I strongly disagree with the idea that spies are unfair.

Given that this is the express server, a country should be penalized for hitting an LaE country where retal by three or four countries is virtually certain. Since we know that HOBO and his Netters Defense League will missile anyone who launches any ss or ps, there should be a penalty for being missiled.

So for this reset, which is about to start, I will award the WoR prize, (Warrior of the Reset) on the following basis:

NW x the country multiplier x number of successful ss x 1.5 number of successful ps x the military grade divided by 2x the number of failed lgs or if no failures 1 x the number of lost lgs x .3 of the number of lost Missile attacks x .20 the number of gs, ab, and br

country multipliers
H M 1
R D C 1.2
I 1.8

military grade considers acreage taken, date of attack and relevance of buildings captured

for example an ss on day one for thirty acres will not receive the same grade as an ss on sunday for 1200 acres.
an F who hits an F will get a higher grade than an F who hits an R whose captured buildings are not as useful
I am not yet certain how this will work so i would appreciae any reasonable comments.

the factors considered for this award should evolve with each reset and as we get more input

comments are welcome but pls keep them reasonable
if all u can do is call me names please post elsewhere

i never said jiff was in LaE

yet another IQ well below average

your an idiot
Jiff69

jiff demonstrtes his inability to grasp the most basic rudiments of english grammar he attempts an ad hominem attack and only wounds himself

for you LaE members it should be "you're an idiot"

as a general rule people who make this error have an IQ between 87 and 94
there have been documented cases of people with IQs as high as 108 making this error but only if english is their second language which does not appear to be this case

so a person with an objectively measured IQ in the low 90s has won express

this is credible because you could teach a chimp to run a netting theocracy which would place in the top ten given the vagaries of this particular server

given that players with much higher IQs are active in this server how can we ensure that chimps do not continue to win?

take a page out of bill clinton's book
change the definition of winning

i will be announcing a proposed new measure of success in the next two days

if you have any input and can speak english i would appreciate your comments

what's really funny is, LaE is still dominating the top 10 - he just ain't quite quick enough to realize it ;-)

OK THIS IS IMPORTANT TO THE GOOD OF THE SERVER

look at the list of the top ten in he last reset
not many recognizable LaE players in it

yet NOW3P the LaE enforcer (CRNA) asserts that LaE still dominates

I BELIEVE HIM and so should YOU

I believe that NOW3P knows the true idenities of countries in the top 10 despite the fact that their names are not LaE

How does he know? they tell him



you do not need to be sherlock holmes to dedeuce that mortcus and cobalt and other netters are in-gaming or MSNing their identities to other LaE members to insure that their theocracies finish high on the NW list

Q.E.D.

jiff said for the sake of he server stop killing LaE

he did not articulate how allowing LaE to own this server as they demonstrably did before the resistance began would be good for the server

the environment on the server is greatly enhanced not diminished by the resistance to LaE

who would play a second reset in a server knowing that LaE's theocracies defended by the LaE enforcers would dominate every reset?

jiff seems to suggest that tinkering, tweaking and fine tuning how to net with a theocracy is somehow some great strategy game
I honestly dont get that I really dont

if u want to protect the good of the server ask hobo to stop his inane nuking of everyone who tries to advance by means of war strategies

Jiff if u care to explain how making this server safe for LaE is good fpr the server I will read your response

He forgot to mention that 4 of them couldn't kill me

rofl

anyone who plays express regularly knows that crna dies
with startling frequency

Croatia may hold the record for most deaths in a single set
and cobalt has an aserisk because he could have been killed 3x but was spared for record keeping reasons
but crna dies nearly every set often twice in a single set

they couldnt kill me even though i had no defense

does he acually believe that? or is he under medication?


what a scream

i am consistemtly stunned by the intellectual capabilities of these guys

i agree with raheel on the spy ops

it is good for the game to have countries with large active spy contingents

if u have spy ops fail all the time as they do now u will discourage their use and a vital part of the game will be lost

LaE which used to own this server has experienced some hard times

1) CRNA again on the verge of death
2) Croatia pounded by numerous players
3) Mortcus afraid to post his LaE name
4) Mr Cobalt afraid to use his name

r they still playing H and winning without ever attacking anyone?

probably

but at least now they are not openly LaE and winning; the guys who are openly LaE are dyiing

this is a great day for this server and for attracting new players

I c the LaE brain trust is up to their usual standards